Fisheries Council

Part of the debate – in Westminster Hall at 10:11 am on 13 January 2004.

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Photo of Alistair Carmichael Alistair Carmichael Shadow Spokesperson (Energy and Climate Change), Liberal Democrat Spokesperson (Energy and Climate Change) 10:11, 13 January 2004

I shall certainly bear your strictures in mind, Mr. McWilliam.

There was much in the speech of Mr. Savidge that would make for interesting debates on different days, but it did not relate to the deal that was struck at last month's Council. I will leave the part of his speech that I could understand for another day. We can discuss it then.

I congratulate Mr. Salmond on securing the debate. It is exceptionally timely. At the start of his speech, he said that he wanted to establish what happened at December's Fisheries Council. I am not as ambitious as the hon. Gentleman. In the time available to me, I merely hope to examine a few issues that are most pertinent to the fishing communities in my constituency and to explore with the Minister where we can go from here.

I associate myself with the remarks of the hon. Member for Banff and Buchan concerning my colleague Ross Finney in the Scottish Parliament. I was exceptionally worried and upset to hear last week that he was going to require heart bypass surgery. I am sure that everyone, both here and in the Scottish Parliament, sends Ross and Phyl Finney their best wishes for a speedy and full recovery.

Whatever the reaction elsewhere in the country, there has been little doubt that the fishermen's organisations in my constituency view the deal as a very bad one. Everywhere I go, the word I hear is "unworkable". Hansen Black, the chief executive of the Shetland Fishermen's Association, said that it was

"a complete and utter disaster for us . . . We would rather have had the status quo from last year."

Given the reaction of his organisation to last year's deal, that is a remarkable statement. Alan Coghill of the Orkney Fisheries Association described it to me as having been written by regulators who have

"no knowledge of the conditions at sea."

There is an important point to make about who said what, when and about what. The initial reaction to the deal was, perhaps, not too hostile, because the detail was not apparent. That in itself betrays the fundamental weakness of the way in which we conduct such negotiations. Fishing industry leaders should have been aware of the detail before Fisheries Ministers signed up to it. That is partly a comment on the Minister himself and partly a comment on a system that has a mad dash at the end of every year to agree what is going to be the capacity of the industry for the succeeding 12 months. I cannot think of another industry, in this country or any other, that would allow itself to be regulated in that way.

The two principal concerns that I wish to bring to the Minister's attention are, first, the question of the number of days at sea and, secondly, what we might call, for short, the map issues—those that relate to the operation of the permit system and some of our spatial management. The regulation grants 10 days a month at sea to UK white fish fleets. Thereafter, extra days at sea must be applied for. They can ask for as many days as they want as long as the total at the end of the month is no more than 15. I do not understand the logic of that because it takes no account of the decommissioning that has taken place during the past two years. The calculations carried out by the Scottish Fishermen's Federation and the Shetland Fishermen's Association mean that we ought to be entitled to about 22 days a month.

If the Minister does not agree with that, perhaps he will tell me why, either today or in correspondence. It would do a great deal for the credibility of his Department and this deal if he published the workings—when I was at school, one used to get credit for showing one's workings—by which he arrived at the number of days specified. It seems to me, and many in the Scottish fishing industry, that the figure of 15 days has been simply plucked from the air.

There is also the issue of force majeur. There is no flexibility in the number of days at sea to take account of those who are taken into port because of bad weather—dodging into port, as it is called—or situations where a boat goes to the assistance of another boat that has experienced a major breakdown. Those are the sort of details that can be resolved between now and the completion of the regulation. I would welcome some reassurance from the Minister that he intends to attend to those issues.

I have severe reservations about the map issues. I do not understand the logic of a system that creates a bilateral approach of cod-sensitive and permit-based fishing areas. Only 20 per cent. of our haddock quota can be taken from the cod-sensitive area, and a restriction of 15 days a month under permit will apply to the remainder of the North sea. My principal concern is that that will push boats in the north of Scotland away from the traditional grounds, where they have always caught large mature haddock, into the nursery areas around Fair Isle and the area known as the jungle to the east of Orkney.

The Minister has said that the fishing industry must take more responsibility for its future, but the fishermen's organisations in my constituency have been saying for years that such areas should be protected. Young stocks in the nursery areas should be afforded protection, but the deal that the Minister has brought back from Brussels will push boats further inshore where they will catch younger, more immature fish which will have long-term consequences for the spawning stock biomass. That will also be of questionable value because it is not valuable to land such fish. There is no real market for small haddock; the market is for the big fish that can be caught in the middle of the cod-sensitive area.

If we look at the totality of the deal—it seems that considering things in their totality is very much the vogue—our fishermen will either have to target cod and end up dumping haddock because of the rigidity of the 5 per cent. by-catch, or they will target haddock under permit and end up dumping cod. Anything that encourages fishermen to dump has got to be bad for fish stocks and the fishing industry. I do not see the upside of that situation. It is the rigidity of the 5 per cent. by-catch rule that appals me most. There may be some scope for making it work a little more flexibly, perhaps by applying the 5 per cent. for a year or a quarter rather than for any individual trip. As things stand, there is not even that much flexibility.

I have taken as much time as I should. I just impress on the Minister that the fishermen's organisations in my constituency are not traditionally the most militant. Their position is well reasoned, and they have a reputation in the industry and in Europe for being exceptionally constructive. If they say that the deal is unworkable, they must be heard.