First Minister’s Question Time – in the Scottish Parliament at on 9 October 2025.
Russell Findlay
Conservative
Yesterday, John Swinney launched yet another taxpayer-funded paper on independence. He has called it a fresh start. [ Interruption .]
Alison Johnstone
Green
Let us hear Mr Findlay.
Russell Findlay
Conservative
They will not be clapping in a minute.
The same John Swinney has dreamed about breaking up the United Kingdom for almost 50 years. He was at the forefront of the free by 93 campaign. He first became leader of the Scottish National Party at the turn of the millennium. In 2014, he played a crucial role in the—losing—yes campaign. Thank you, John. Last year, he became SNP leader again. He really thinks that it is plausible to describe his latest independence paper as a fresh start. Is John Swinney having a laugh?
Alison Johnstone
Green
Use full names at all times, please.
John Swinney
Scottish National Party
Before I respond to Mr Findlay, I want to take a moment to welcome the news that Israel and Hamas have agreed the first phase of a peace plan for Gaza. I call for all sides to abide by the terms of the agreement, for the release of all hostages and for the immediate entry of humanitarian aid into Gaza. I know that, after more than two years of devastating brutality and loss of life, this will be a moment of relief for many here, in Scotland, and around the world. I reiterate my call that Palestinians and Israelis must be able to live safely side by side, based on a two-state solution. I dearly hope that this is the first step towards that outcome, and I express my thanks to all the mediators who have worked so hard to create this moment and this opportunity for peace. [ Applause .]
In relation to Mr Findlay’s substantive question, I am deadly serious about the argument for Scottish independence. As a country, we have exercised self-government since 1999, with the establishment of this Parliament. A number of significant benefits have been achieved for the people of Scotland. Some of those, such as the ban on smoking in public places and the introduction of free personal care, were delivered by the previous Government and some of them were delivered by my Government—including the abolition of tuition fees, minimum unit pricing for alcohol and the introduction of the Scottish child payment.
We are at a moment now, in Scotland, when the rightward drift of the United Kingdom and the stagnation of living standards in our country demonstrate a need to re-examine the argument. That is why independence is the fresh start that Scotland needs.
Russell Findlay
Conservative
The fact that he says that he is deadly serious is actually even more worrying than if he had just been having a laugh. John Swinney cannot offer a fresh start, because he has been in the SNP Government for almost 20 years. He was Nicola Sturgeon’s and Alex Salmond’s right-hand man. He was up to his neck in every SNP scandal: ferries, gender self-identification, Scottish Qualifications Authority exams, named persons and many more. He ran down Scotland’s economy and then he ran down Scotland’s education system.
A new survey shows that public trust in the Scottish Government is at an all-time low—and it is a Scottish Government survey. Does John Swinney accept that that is a damning judgment of his dismal record?
John Swinney
Scottish National Party
What my Government is focused on is improving the lives of people in Scotland. That is why we are keeping prescriptions free in Scotland while they are nearly £10 under Labour in England; it is why we are protecting free tuition in Scotland while fees are rising south of the border; it is why we have expanded free early learning and childcare, extended free school meals, introduced the Scottish child payment and abolished—for good—peak rail fares on our railways. We are interested in providing practical support to improve the lives of people in Scotland, and we will continue to do that.
I notice that, in the survey that Mr Findlay is talking about, there is also a question on independence. It indicates that support for independence is at 47 per cent—up from 27 per cent in 1999. [ Interruption .]
Alison Johnstone
Green
Thank you, members.
John Swinney
Scottish National Party
I can see the direction of travel in Scotland—it is going towards independence.
Russell Findlay
Conservative
Nicola Sturgeon’s book should be in the fiction section, but John Swinney’s paper should really be in the fantasy section. It is not just harmless fantasy but dangerous dishonesty. This graph here, from his paper, says that Scotland’s gross domestic product has grown faster than that of the rest of the UK when the opposite is true.
Serious and credible experts have demolished the Government’s 90-page exercise in wishful thinking. Leading economist Professor Ronald MacDonald said that John Swinney’s plans were “totally shambolic” and that they would have “a devastating effect”. He expressed astonishment at the “total ignorance” of the SNP’s currency position. Damningly, he said that all of that would impact on public sector wages, pensions, mortgages and borrowing costs for homes and businesses. [ Interruption .]
Alison Johnstone
Green
Let us hear Mr Findlay.
Russell Findlay
Conservative
John Swinney’s paper offers no solutions. It does nothing to help people’s lives here and now. It is an outrage that it was produced by Scottish civil servants. Will John Swinney stop wasting taxpayers’ money on such nonsense?
John Swinney
Scottish National Party
Under the SNP Government, GDP per person has grown by 10.3 per cent in Scotland compared with 6.1 per cent in the UK, while productivity has grown at an average rate of 1.1 per cent per year in Scotland compared with the UK average of 0.4 per cent. That demonstrates that the point that Mr Findlay has put to Parliament is not correct. [ Interruption .]
Alison Johnstone
Green
Let us hear the First Minister.
John Swinney
Scottish National Party
The issue that Mr Findlay must address is that the arguments that he puts forward for preserving the status quo are now completely and utterly threadbare. Labour and Tory politicians said that staying in the United Kingdom would lower our Bills, but the opposite has been the case. They promised financial security but gave us the Liz Truss mini-budget. They assured us that voting no was the surest way for Scotland to remain in the European Union, but Scotland has been taken out of the EU against our will. The arguments against Scottish independence have collapsed since 2014, and Scotland is on a pathway to independence.
Russell Findlay
Conservative
John Swinney’s graph on GDP is wrong, just as the stats that he gave last week on income tax were wrong. If he ever got his way, it would mean extreme tax rises and severe spending cuts for Scotland. Mortgages would go up, pensions would be put at risk and there would be a hard border with England. Scotland would be divided and would be smaller and weaker.
Despite all of that, John Swinney keeps obsessing about independence, which would make Scots poorer. It is no wonder that public trust in the SNP is at an all-time low. [ Interruption .]
Alison Johnstone
Green
Let us hear one another.
Russell Findlay
Conservative
John Swinney is not a fresh start. He is a tired nationalist with a dismal record. He is not focused on building a strong economy for the future. He is wasting time and taxpayers’ money on the same old arguments of the past. For the sake of Scotland, is he ever going to give up on his independence obsession and move on?
John Swinney
Scottish National Party
It is pretty clear to any member of the public watching this exchange that the more Russell Findlay gets personally insulting to his political rivals—[ Interruption .]
Alison Johnstone
Green
Let us all hear one another.
John Swinney
Scottish National Party
—the weaker his arguments become. What I have marshalled and put in front of Parliament today is the evidence. Living standards in Scotland are stagnating, and they have stagnated for 15 years. [ Interruption .]
Alison Johnstone
Green
It is becoming increasingly difficult to hear one another. I ask members who have not been called to speak to please resist the temptation to do so. I am sure that the people who are gathered in the gallery would wish to hear contributions.
John Swinney
Scottish National Party
Living standards in Scotland, as part of the United Kingdom, have ground to a halt. Brexit has been a disaster. The implications of the Liz Truss mini-budget have wreaked economic difficulty and havoc on the people of the UK, and Scotland has been saddled with that, despite the promises of lower prices, lower Bills and access to the European Union that were made by the no campaign in 2014.
I am very proud to lead a campaign that is about focusing on improving living standards in Scotland and transforming the lives of the people of Scotland, and we will do that through independence.
Question Time is an opportunity for MPs and Members of the House of Lords to ask Government Ministers questions. These questions are asked in the Chamber itself and are known as Oral Questions. Members may also put down Written Questions. In the House of Commons, Question Time takes place for an hour on Mondays, Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays after Prayers. The different Government Departments answer questions according to a rota and the questions asked must relate to the responsibilities of the Government Department concerned. In the House of Lords up to four questions may be asked of the Government at the beginning of each day's business. They are known as 'starred questions' because they are marked with a star on the Order Paper. Questions may also be asked at the end of each day's business and these may include a short debate. They are known as 'unstarred questions' and are less frequent. Questions in both Houses must be written down in advance and put on the agenda and both Houses have methods for selecting the questions that will be asked. Further information can be obtained from factsheet P1 at the UK Parliament site.
Ministers make up the Government and almost all are members of the House of Lords or the House of Commons. There are three main types of Minister. Departmental Ministers are in charge of Government Departments. The Government is divided into different Departments which have responsibilities for different areas. For example the Treasury is in charge of Government spending. Departmental Ministers in the Cabinet are generally called 'Secretary of State' but some have special titles such as Chancellor of the Exchequer. Ministers of State and Junior Ministers assist the ministers in charge of the department. They normally have responsibility for a particular area within the department and are sometimes given a title that reflects this - for example Minister of Transport.
A proposal for new legislation that is debated by Parliament.
The political party system in the English-speaking world evolved in the 17th century, during the fight over the ascension of James the Second to the Throne. James was a Catholic and a Stuart. Those who argued for Parliamentary supremacy were called Whigs, after a Scottish word whiggamore, meaning "horse-driver," applied to Protestant rebels. It was meant as an insult.
They were opposed by Tories, from the Irish word toraidhe (literally, "pursuer," but commonly applied to highwaymen and cow thieves). It was used — obviously derisively — to refer to those who supported the Crown.
By the mid 1700s, the words Tory and Whig were commonly used to describe two political groupings. Tories supported the Church of England, the Crown, and the country gentry, while Whigs supported the rights of religious dissent and the rising industrial bourgeoisie. In the 19th century, Whigs became Liberals; Tories became Conservatives.