3. Will the First Minister provide an update on the planning and permits systems regulating the poultry industry? OQ61580

The planning and environmental permitting systems operate within separate statutory frameworks. In accordance with environmental permitting regulations, units with more than 40,000 poultry places will have to obtain a permit to operate. Planning permission will be required to develop most poultry units at a large scale.

Thank you very much for that. You'll perhaps be aware that new welfare requirements are being introduced by supermarkets, which means that more space is required by poultry in such units. That is perfectly fair, but it means that more sheds are needed to sustain the same number of chickens and the same level of productivity—not more chickens or waste or traffic, but they do need those additional sheds. And the impasse that we're seeing within the current planning system makes it unlikely that these new sheds will be able to be constructed in time to meet the demand, and that's going to undermine those farms that are dependent on the ability to provide poultry. And, indeed, it is problematic for the food processors who are themselves dependent. One company said that they would need 24 additional sheds just to sustain their current productivity levels, not increase what is being produced. Now, the irony is, of course, that the Welsh Government has been investing in some of these food producers, investing in some of these food processors, which, if they can't have the throughput, will have to move from Wales. So, the question is: what are you going to do to ensure that this problem is solved and that these people who do need additional sheds can receive urgent consent so that they can meet the demands next year?

Diolch yn fawr. Well, we know that Natural Resources Wales are very keen to make sure that we review the regulation in terms of enforcement of spreading of organic materials on land in Wales, and I think it is important that we take a precautionary approach to the situation. Last week we were talking about pollution in our rivers, and it is important, I think, for us to get this right. And what I do recognise is that there are a number of permits that are in the planning process and that they are being halted at the moment, but I think that is absolutely the right thing to do. What we have done is there is a control of the agricultural pollutions regulations review, and I'm pleased to say that Dr Susannah Bolton has been appointed to the role of chair. I think that is an important milestone to ensure that the review is undertaken in a collaborative way. The fact is that 44 per cent of our rivers are in a good ecological status. It's not enough, but it's three times as many as in England. There is a huge amount to do, but I think that it's important for us to wait until we know exactly what is the right thing to do in order to make sure that we don't see more pollution in our rivers than is necessary.

First Minister, very similar but on a different topic to Llyr Gruffydd, I’m very pleased that we do have some of the very best animal welfare standards when it comes to poultry in Wales and across the UK. Now, under current legislation, if birds are forced to be housed for a period of time greater than 16 weeks—by occurrences such as avian influenza, for example—free-range farms lose their free-range status. That’s the current position. The UK Government for England and the Scottish Government carried out a joint consultation together to change that legislation so that farms would not lose that status should birds be housed due to Government intervention. And the Welsh Government took a very different approach on that and decided not to be involved in that process. And my question is not so much about the rights and wrongs of that, but the issue is that if Wales takes a different approach to the rest of the UK, then Welsh poultry farmers are going to be disadvantaged. There’s also going to be significant confusion as well to the consumer.

So, First Minister, I wonder if you are aware of this, and if you are, can you set out why the Welsh Government took a different approach? Do you agree with me and acknowledge that it would be far better to have a UK-wide position on this matter? And, thirdly, will you agree to discuss this matter with the Deputy First Minister, who I’ve corresponded with on this matter as well?

I’d be very happy to speak to my deputy about this matter. I think it is important that we make sure that we have a thorough understanding of that situation in relation to free-range status, so we’ll look into that.

Chicken manure contains high levels of nitrogen and phosphorus. It makes a great fertiliser for crops. When the nutrients reach waterways, they can result in the excessive growth of algae, starving the river of oxygen. With chicken sheds producing huge amounts of manure, I am told that some farmers have been spreading it on fields as fertiliser. What action is taken in the planning and permit system to ensure that chicken manure does not reach rivers and cause eutrophication?

Thanks very much, and this is precisely why we’ve got that moratorium. It’s exactly to make sure that there is an appropriate way to make sure that the manure doesn’t find its way into our rivers. It’s a real problem; it’s not a problem just for rivers, it also has massive implications for housing and planning and all of these other things. We’ve got to get this right, but while we’re getting it right, what would be the wrong thing to do is to just carry on allowing more and more of these facilities to develop, until we’re clear about how we stop the pollution from continuing. So, thank you for that question.