2. Will the First Minister make a statement on the challenges facing the social care sector this winter? OQ61553

Social care faces population changes and rising demand. As a Government, we are working with leaders across our health and social care system to build capacity for care and support in our communities, to manage the challenges of increasing demand for more complex care for our ageing and frail population.

Investment in social care will help unlock some of the challenges in our health service. The data shows that there are far too many patients in our hospitals waiting for care at home or in the community. The need for step-down bed facilities that meet the current and future needs of our ageing population is essential. I welcome the plans for a new £15 million facility in Ferndale, but residents and staff at Ferndale House are anxious about their future, given the planned closure. I've written to Rhondda Cynon Taf council for further information, and intend to visit the home later this week. Could you outline how the Welsh Government will support the sector this winter, including funding for step-down facilities and tackling delays in home adaptations? And do you agree that the new facilities are critical to the long-term strategy, but that transitions from older facilities must cause as little disruption as posisble?

Thanks very much. You're quite right—we've got to be sensitive to the people who are in those homes, and, if there's any disruption, that's incredibly difficult, partiuclarly for those people with dementia, who are much more comfortable with the same routine and the same environment. We have a ministerial-led care action committee, which ensures that, as a Government, we're working very closely with the NHS and local government to address those issues of care and the need to make sure that we look at that opportunity to develop more support in our communities. You'll be aware that there's £70 million for rebalancing care and support, in terms of a capital fund. Already, Rhondda Cynon Taf has been awarded £7.6 million of that, towards the redevelopment of Bronllwyn in Gelli. But, just in terms of Ferndale, it is referenced within Cwm Taf's capital plan, but we haven't seen an application yet in the Welsh Government.

The Age Cymru report published in August shows that, while 12-month social care delays have been slowly coming down, we still have one in six waiting more than 30 days for a social care package to be implemented, unfortunately. Delays in social care are still unacceptably high, with social care leads laying the blame substantially on a lack of sustainable funding. In Denbighshire, in my constituency, the situation is much more acute due to Denbighshire County Council offering rock-bottom fees after approving only an 8.8 per cent increase in fees, compared to neighbouring Conwy's 20 per cent. This increase is wiped out by inflation and the cost-of-living crisis, and we are now facing a 1,600 care home bed deficit in north Wales alone over the next decade. This also means that Denbighshire County Council will be paying over £9,000 a year less per person than in Conwy for the same care. Care Forum Wales have said that this alarming deficit has illustrated the need for social care to be funded properly for existing homes to survive and to encourage the development of new ones. Many care homes in Denbighshire are now teetering on the brink, with others having closed already. So, can the First Minister outline her Government's plan regarding the funding of social services, and what oversight will be given to local authorities to ensure that they properly fund the sector and avert the impeding deficit of care home capacity in my constituency? Thank you.

Thanks very much, Gareth. You'll be aware that part of the challenge in relation to care is the fact that, actually, it's difficult to recruit people into the sector. And we, in Wales, have awarded the people who work in our care sector the real living wage, and that is making a difference. The fact is that, in August 2023, we had 58,000 people registered, and today we have 63,000. So, it's good to see that is making a difference. We recognise that there are still serious challenges, but that money was ring-fenced and given to local authorities, and that is the biggest challenge, I think, in the sector. But you'll be aware also that we've done significant work in the social care fair work forum, and what we're trying to do is to make sure that we work in partnership to improve the terms and conditions for social care workers. Something we're trying to do is to get more consistency in terms of how local authorities address the issue of care, and there's a huge amount of work already being undertaken in that space. There's more to do, but I think we're way ahead of anything that's happening in England in this space.

The pressures on social care can have a terrible effect on unpaid carers and their loved ones. I wonder if I could press you, First Minister, on how your Government's charter for unpaid carers, which was published nearly two years ago, can result in tangible improvements. My office has been helping and supporting a family whose adult son used to attend Springfield day centre in Pontllanfraith. Now, since COVID, the centre has never fully reopened and their number of respite hours has reduced drastically. This has left them and many other people in the same situation without the support they need. The pressures on social care and on local government are pushing unpaid carers to the limit. It's pushing them beyond the limits and they're suffering with the bits of a broken, underfunded system. So, what reassurance could you give my constituents and others like them that the voice of unpaid carers will, at last, be listened to, please? 

Well, thanks very much, and I know the big champion for unpaid carers in this Chamber is Julie Morgan. She's been absolutely a champion for unpaid carers for several years, and I'd like to thank her for the work that she's been doing.

We recognise that local authorities have to make really difficult decisions, and some of them have made the decision to close some of those day centres, which, of course, were places where people could go to have a little bit of time and respite while people were sent to those day-care centres. They still exist in many places, and certainly one of the things that I visited recently was a project in Merthyr, where they, actually, were working with the NHS to provide a broader day-care package. So, I think we've probably got to be a bit more creative in terms of getting the NHS and local authorities to see what more they can do in that space. But I recognise it's a very, very difficult task. I know, as my mother suffers from Alzheimer's, and it's a lot of pressure on people who are dealing with those situations. It is very difficult, it is very tiring, and people are determined to help their loved ones and not let them down, but they also need the support. I think what we're trying to do is to make sure that we recognise that, and, of course, we do have a huge amount and a big project of support for unpaid carers.

Good afternoon, First Minister. I'm sure we all know the real thankless task that many of our carers, both unpaid and paid, adopt, and I know that many in this Siambr as well have undertaken that role in relation to their relatives or friends. I myself have done it, but only for a very short time, and I have total admiration for all of those people who are unpaid carers and paid carers. You talk about the real living wage in Wales for carers, and that's a great initiative, but, in Powys, where we've tried to recruit carers, there were two sessions where absolutely nobody turned up. So, in a rural area we have real pressures in trying to recruit carers. So, one of the things that the Liberal Democrats are pushing for, as you will know, I hope, not through any stunts that you might have seen by a certain party leader, is that we want to see an increased wage for our carers. We want to see an extra £2, at least, paid to them, as well as real career progression and a real recognition, and a level of esteem given to those carers. So, what can the Welsh Government do in order to raise the esteem and the level of carers across Wales, but particularly in our rural areas? Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Thanks very much. It is a really challenging situation, particularly when there are other jobs available that are perhaps not as difficult and as challenging. But the fact is that we in Wales are awarding the real living wage. There was a huge reaction in Liverpool to the fact that we pay the real living wage in Wales. It’s something that people shouldn’t take for granted. It doesn’t happen everywhere else in the country. The fact is about 2,000 people left after Brexit. There were lots of eastern European citizens who were helping us out, and it’s been really difficult to backfill those positions. But what we have done is we’ve developed a very concerted programme to try and support carers with career progression, making sure that they get the training that they deserve and need, and to professionalise the system. I recognise that, in an ideal world, I think we’d all like to see carers be paid more, but the challenging financial situation does make that incredibly difficult, and I recognise that it’s particularly challenging in rural areas.