– in the Senedd at 5:34 pm on 30 April 2024.
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
5:34,
30 April 2024
That brings us to group 8. This group of amendments relates to annual reports of the Democracy and Boundary Commission Cymru. Amendment 41 is the lead amendment and I call on Darren Millar to speak to it.
Darren Millar
Conservative
5:34,
30 April 2024
Diolch, Llywydd. I rise to move Amendment 41. If the Senedd Cymru (Members and Elections) Bill is passed, then the renamed Democracy and Boundary Commission Cymru will have a very important task of reviewing the boundaries of Senedd constituencies, alongside all of the other responsibilities it is going to acquire. So, the work of the commission is going to be very important to us all as Members of the Senedd, and indeed to many others as well, and with its decisions and recommendations impacting us all, it's obviously very important that we take a great deal of interest in its work.
Now, the Local Government and Housing Committee produced a Stage 1 report in respect of the Elections and Elected Bodies (Wales) Bill, which made a recommendation in respect of this Senedd reform bill, which we are considering. It recommended that the Welsh Government should amend the Senedd Cymru (Members and Elections) Bill to strengthen the accountability of the Democracy and Boundary Commission Cymru to the Senedd, by requiring the commission's annual report to be debated by the Senedd. Now, the Welsh Government hasn't to date brought forward an amendment to bring about that particular change, which is why I'm tabling it at this stage.
Now, it's only reasonable to expect the Government to pay attention to the recommendations of that cross-party committee that scrutinises legislation, and I very much hope that it will be happy to support this particular recommendation. It's not a contentious one. It's one that I think we all agree should happen, to make sure that these things see the light of day and have the proper scrutiny—particularly, as I say, with the much wider remit and responsibilities that the new Democracy and Boundary Commission Cymru will actually have. And, of course, the amendment will also ensure that Welsh Ministers have to make arrangements for the Senedd to be able to consider these things within 12 weeks of the report being published, which I think is a perfectly reasonable amount of time. It gives time for the Government, and indeed Members of the Senedd, to digest the report before it's debated on the floor of the Senedd or by a Senedd committee, and it ensures that there is that accountability between the commission and the Senedd, which it serves, and democracy, which it serves. So, I commend the recommendation and the amendment, which I've tabled to the Senedd.
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
5:37,
30 April 2024
The Counsel General to contribute to this debate.
Mick Antoniw
Labour
Diolch, Llywydd. I thank the Member for those comments. The Amendment is similar to a recommendation included in the Local Government and Housing Committee's Stage 1 report on the Elections and Elected Bodies (Wales) Bill, that there be a requirement for the Democracy and Boundary Commission Cymru's annual report to be debated by the Senedd. Just of course to remind Members that there is already provision in respect of submission of a report to Welsh Members and for publication. But for these reasons, I set out in my written response to that report that I will not be supporting the amendment.
Whilst I accepted the recommendation in principle, the Reform Bill Committee separately recommended that the Business Committee consider the DBCC's accountability arrangements as part of its procedural review prior to the 2026 election. So, I do not wish, therefore, to pre-empt the outcome of that review, so I will not seek to amend the Senedd Cymru (Members and Elections) Bill for that particular reason. Diolch, Llywydd,
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
5:38,
30 April 2024
Darren Millar to reply.
Darren Millar
Conservative
Thank you, Llywydd, and thank you, Minister, for at least explaining your position on this particular Amendment. Obviously, I'm disappointed. I think this is a straightforward amendment. I don't think it's controversial at all. And even if there were some accountability arrangements within a Senedd committee, and the Business Committee, of which I am a member, of course, considers it appropriate for a particular committee to take on this role, it shouldn't stop the report being laid before the Senedd more formally for consideration. So, I'm going to push it to a vote. I think it fulfils and ticks the box in terms of the recommendation that was made by the Local Government and Housing Committee, and, as I say, I think it does what it needs to do, which is to ensure that we shine a light on the important work of the Democracy and Boundary Commission Cymru in the future, on an annual basis, to make sure that all Members are aware of its work on their behalf, and indeed the wider democratic institutions across Wales.
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
5:39,
30 April 2024
The question is that Amendment 41 be agreed. Does any Member object? [Objection.] There is objection. We will therefore move to a vote on amendment 41. Open the vote. Close the vote. In favour 15, no abstentions, 37 against. And therefore amendment 41 is not agreed.
Division number 5155
Amendment 41
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
5:40,
30 April 2024
Amendment 51, is it moved by Adam Price?
Adam Price
Plaid Cymru
No, I won't be moving it.
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
No, Amendment 51 is not moved, so we do not need a vote.
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
5:40,
30 April 2024
Amendment 115, is it moved, Adam Price? No, and we will therefore not vote on that.
As a bill passes through Parliament, MPs and peers may suggest amendments - or changes - which they believe will improve the quality of the legislation.
Many hundreds of amendments are proposed by members to major bills as they pass through committee stage, report stage and third reading in both Houses of Parliament.
In the end only a handful of amendments will be incorporated into any bill.
The Speaker - or the chairman in the case of standing committees - has the power to select which amendments should be debated.
As a bill passes through Parliament, MPs and peers may suggest amendments - or changes - which they believe will improve the quality of the legislation.
Many hundreds of amendments are proposed by members to major bills as they pass through committee stage, report stage and third reading in both Houses of Parliament.
In the end only a handful of amendments will be incorporated into any bill.
The Speaker - or the chairman in the case of standing committees - has the power to select which amendments should be debated.
Ministers make up the Government and almost all are members of the House of Lords or the House of Commons. There are three main types of Minister. Departmental Ministers are in charge of Government Departments. The Government is divided into different Departments which have responsibilities for different areas. For example the Treasury is in charge of Government spending. Departmental Ministers in the Cabinet are generally called 'Secretary of State' but some have special titles such as Chancellor of the Exchequer. Ministers of State and Junior Ministers assist the ministers in charge of the department. They normally have responsibility for a particular area within the department and are sometimes given a title that reflects this - for example Minister of Transport.
The House of Commons votes by dividing. Those voting Aye (yes) to any proposition walk through the division lobby to the right of the Speaker and those voting no through the lobby to the left. In each of the lobbies there are desks occupied by Clerks who tick Members' names off division lists as they pass through. Then at the exit doors the Members are counted by two Members acting as tellers. The Speaker calls for a vote by announcing "Clear the Lobbies". In the House of Lords "Clear the Bar" is called. Division Bells ring throughout the building and the police direct all Strangers to leave the vicinity of the Members’ Lobby. They also walk through the public rooms of the House shouting "division". MPs have eight minutes to get to the Division Lobby before the doors are closed. Members make their way to the Chamber, where Whips are on hand to remind the uncertain which way, if any, their party is voting. Meanwhile the Clerks who will take the names of those voting have taken their place at the high tables with the alphabetical lists of MPs' names on which ticks are made to record the vote. When the tellers are ready the counting process begins - the recording of names by the Clerk and the counting of heads by the tellers. When both lobbies have been counted and the figures entered on a card this is given to the Speaker who reads the figures and announces "So the Ayes [or Noes] have it". In the House of Lords the process is the same except that the Lobbies are called the Contents Lobby and the Not Contents Lobby. Unlike many other legislatures, the House of Commons and the House of Lords have not adopted a mechanical or electronic means of voting. This was considered in 1998 but rejected. Divisions rarely take less than ten minutes and those where most Members are voting usually take about fifteen. Further information can be obtained from factsheet P9 at the UK Parliament site.
