Questions now from the party spokespeople. The Conservative spokesperson, Laura Anne Jones. 

Diolch, Llywydd. Minister, I recently read your piece in LabourList—a first for me, I must admit. But it had an interesting quote:

'Over time the funding spent on schools will increase as a percentage of the Welsh Government's budget. In fact, actually it builds on the work that I've already been doing.'

Minister, I did a double take when I read your quote. Was that just an attempt to pull the wool over the eyes of your own Labour members or your failure in office? I would love to know what this work is that you're building on, because it sure isn't an increase in funding. The facts are clear: you have cut the education budget this year in cash terms by £56 million. In real terms, that represents a £140 million reduction, and this on top of a cash and real-terms cut last year.

Mark Drakeford as First Minister has failed to prioritise education, just like his predecessors. Will you now, on record, say that, if you were First Minister, you would, at the very least, drop these pet projects of blanket 20 mph and hundreds of millions of pounds spent on more politicians, and plough that money where it is needed, in our children's education in Wales?

Might I suggest the Member focus her scrutiny efforts on my current role as education Minister? Might I also suggest that she reads rather more closely what she’s been finding in LabourList? But I’m sure LabourList will be very pleased to hear the extent of their reach.

As she will know from the discussions we’ve had in the committee and elsewhere, the Government has protected, in the Welsh Government budget, the sums that go to schools, both in the very difficult set of choices that we had to make in relation to in-year reductions last year, and in relation to the choices we’ve had to make to deal with the pressures in the 2024-25 budget. She will know that the grants we pay to schools have retained their value in both of those years. Indeed, the approach that we are taking now, which is to make those grants more flexible, more easily deployed by schools, is intended to make them even more valuable, and put trust in the hands of local authorities and teachers about how best to reach the outcomes that we have as shared priorities with them.

Minister, on the back of consecutive years of education budget cuts, it is clear that you’re now trying to claim that there is extra money going into education via local government budgets. But the reality is that councils such as the Labour-run Monmouthshire, for example, are actually proposing to cut their education budget to the tune of nearly £1 million. We see similar cuts from Caerphilly council and other councils across Wales. Your words simply don’t match the reality on the ground. The money that has been diverted to the local government budget, and promised to schools by you, is simply just going to plug the gaps from council cuts, which means there is absolutely no guarantee that money will get where it’s urgently needed in our schools. Minister, you claim there is an increase in funding to education. With the cuts at Senedd and council level, how will this equate to an increase in funding?

I actually said that schools grants had been preserved, rather than increased, so let’s have some regard to what I actually said in response to your earlier questions. The truth is councils right across Wales, heads right across Wales, managing difficult budgets, will know what is at the heart of that, and it is the fact that we have a Conservative Government in Westminster handing out austerity budgets to us in Wales and other parts of the UK. They understand very well what is at the heart of this challenge. [Interruption.] There is no pulling the wool—there is no pulling the wool—over their eyes in the way that the Member is seeking to do. And she will know very well that, day in, day out, teachers are doing their best to manage very challenging budgets, and I commend them for that in very difficult circumstances. What we need is a Labour Government in Westminster prepared to invest in public services, as we do here in Wales.

Yet, Minister, education standards have gone up in England significantly, haven't they, yet they've gone down in Wales, and the rest of the UK have all gone up, apart from Wales. Your time as education Minister can only be characterised by one word: failure. You now enter a leadership campaign promising the world, like in LabourList—I'll name-check them again—but, in reality, you have failed the next generation at every turn. Minister, I once again found myself perplexed by reading your leadership bid comments. You said, and I quote, 

'Under my leadership, we will have unapologetically high expectations in education'.

And this is coming from a man who's presided over Wales's worst ever PISA results, the worst educational outcomes in the UK on record. Minister, this Labour Government has refused to apologise for decades of failure in education, which has put Wales on the bottom of every education league table. And, to make matters worse, you refuse to set a target for the next set of PISA results in three years' time, or even the one after, to be held accountable against. Minister, you risk our children and young people's future by failing to tackle the teacher recruitment crisis; you have failed to end violence in schools, in fact, letting it spiral out of control; you have failed ALN students by refusing to meet their demands, those that are deaf, those who have sight problems, those with speech and language issues, who are simply not getting what they need, and you know it. You have piled directive after directive, pressure after pressure on our teachers, on our schools, and have not followed it with the money to deliver. This may be your last education Minister questions. Can you, on record, say that you are genuinely proud of your record in office? Will you, as one of your potentially last acts as education Minister, finally commit to setting a target for the next set of PISA results, as part of your commitment to unapologetically high standards, and show some actual ambition to try and drag Wales up to at least the level of the rest of the UK, if not, hopefully, above?

Well, by the looks of the benches behind the Member, the fact that she's reading my speeches with quite such detail isn't doing her own leadership ambitions any good at all [Laughter.] She, as always, makes the comparison between Wales and England. England, Conservative England, in which schools are crumbling—in which schools are crumbling—which saw seven days lost to strikes last year, which has education spending lower than it is in Wales, which has the unit rate of free school meals lower than it is for Wales, which has—  

I allowed the Member to have a very long time to ask her question. I now need the Minister to be heard in his answer. Thank you, Minister.  

Llywydd, I'll begin again, if I may, because I don't think the benches opposite heard this: school buildings crumbling in England compared to Wales; strikes in England in schools for seven days, compared to two days in Wales; education spending lower in England than it is in Wales—[Interruption.]—absolutely; support for students lower in England than it is for Wales. In any of these measures, I would be embarrassed to be highlighting Conservative England to us as an example in Wales. 

The Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Sioned Williams. 

Thank you, Llywydd. The Welsh Government’s draft budget will make significant cuts to post-16 education, with some of the most prominent cuts to education being in funding for postgraduate studies. There is no doubt that moving to a loan-only system for postgraduate students will increase levels of inequality in terms of access to higher education, especially given that students have been hit extremely hard by the cost-of-living crisis. NUS Wales has heard from a number of postgraduate students in Wales who say that they would not have been able to undertake their studies if it were not for the grant element of their financial support. For example, one student at Cardiff University, who’s a single parent, said that she would not be able to study and keep a roof over her child’s head without the grant. This student returned to university to reskill for a career in heritage, something that Wales, as a second-chance nation, should celebrate and encourage. I know that you agree that education can transform lives and help eradicate poverty across generations. So, how are you going to mitigate the impact of this on our brightest students who come from the most disadvantaged backgrounds? And do you accept that these cuts will increase socioeconomic inequality in terms of access to higher education?

Well, these decisions are exceptionally difficult, and the challenge raised by the Member is fair. They are not easy decisions to make. The choice we have as Ministers is how we can use the scarce resources that we have and what will have the most positive, progressive impact in enhancing equality, prosperity and well-being within our communities, and the choice that I had to make in this context was to consider whether we would continue to provide grants to a relatively limited group of people at the end of an academic journey or whether we would use those funds to ensure that every child in every school in Wales gets the support that they need for those core skills.

And on the point that the Member makes in terms of ensuring that we have an equal society, providing every opportunity for individuals to prosper, we know from evidence that the earlier in the education journey that you spend that money, the more positive the impact will be over the course of one's life. So, that is what's at the core of the decision that I've had to make to prioritise the pre-16 sector and use some of the postgraduate grant funding in order to do that. We still offer the most supportive system in Wales in supporting first-time graduates, and we're very pleased to be doing that. 

Thank you. Of course, those higher skills and the need to reskill is something that closes the equality gap in terms of wages and attainment, and also as regards our economy as well. And the Government's own analysis shows that the cuts to postgraduate grants and bursaries will have a disproportionate impact on specific groups within society. For example, women who want to study STEMM subjects and also Welsh speakers. One student who is pursuing an MSc course at Aberystwyth, for example, said that she would not have been able to meet basic living costs without the bursary from the Welsh Government.

Master's courses provide those advanced skills that are essential to the development of those fields or institutions and, as I said, our economy, through innovation and research. And the removal of those bursaries that support postgraduate studies taught through the medium of Welsh also undermines the urgent need to ensure Welsh language skills among those who lead within our workforces. Do you accept that, by introducing these cuts, the Government is likely to widen the gender pay gap and undermine the goal, perhaps, in the 'Cymraeg 2050' action plan to develop the Welsh-medium workforce, because if we don't support Welsh-medium postgraduate students, who is going to develop the necessary resources and technology that we need to increase the number of Welsh speakers, increase the use of the Welsh language and create favourable conditions for the Welsh language?

I understand why the Member asks the question, but I don't agree that that's the impact of this. These bursaries are important, but they are in addition to a student support system that is among the most generous of any part of the UK. So, that's an important consideration here. This is additional funding on top of a system that is already very supportive and reaches a small number of people. So, just as I had to make a decision in terms of moving from grants to loans for postgraduates, it's the same thinking that's behind this. 

She asked the question as to whether this will have a disproportionate impact. Well, it will if you look at this particular source of funding, but my argument would be that if you do not prioritise those earlier years, then that will have an even more disproportionate impact. And therefore, given the challenge that we face and the process that we have of balancing the impact of one cut against another, my decision is to ensure that we prioritise school years, because we do know just how important they are in providing opportunities later in life to people generally.