6. 6. Debate on Stage 3 of the Public Health (Wales) Bill – in the Senedd at 4:36 pm on 9 May 2017.
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
4:36,
9 May 2017
The next group of amendments relates to improving and protecting the health and well-being of young persons. Amendment 33 is the lead amendment in this group, and I call on Angela Burns to move and speak to the lead amendment and the other amendments in the group. Angela Burns.
Angela Burns
Conservative
4:37,
9 May 2017
Diolch, Llywydd. The Welsh Conservatives have tabled this Amendment inserting a new section into the Bill that seeks to ensure that Welsh Ministers have to produce a comprehensive report on an annual basis detailing progress made in the delivery of public health objectives, with emphasis on those that protect and improve the health and well-being of young persons. There is no doubt that ensuring people stay well and maintain a healthy lifestyle is of vital importance to the individual, and, consequently, is of enormous benefit to the public purse. Educating the younger generation is an obvious place to start. If we can prove their physical and mental health and sense of well-being, then we are all alleviating the pressures of the future. Public health researchers at Cardiff University found that following a healthy lifestyle—not smoking, maintaining a healthy body weight, limiting alcohol intake—are integral in curbing the likelihood of chronic illness.
This amendment also seeks to ensure that focus is maintained on the vital importance of public health to ensure that all Assembly Members are able to effectively scrutinise the outcomes of this legislation by virtue of an annual report, which will provide both Welsh Government and Assembly Members the opportunity to benchmark and monitor progress. The data produced by this exercise will also inform the wider debate over the acute challenges we face in public health. The OECD report 2016 identified that Wales lacked robust data-reporting mechanisms to accurately reflect key parameters needed to improve health services across Wales. When you consider that socioeconomic deprivation is directly linked to public health outcomes, personified by the fact that lung cancer prevalence is highest in south-east Wales valleys, it is clear that we need not only to collect data to improve public health outcomes, but we also need to promote a prevention-first strategy, in which children and young people are put to the forefront of public health messaging in Wales.
That recent OECD report acknowledged a 10-year decline in reporting across Wales. The report went on to stipulate that there is potential for community health councils to play a valuable role in reflecting the patient voice across Wales. It is critical now that the Welsh Government acts to not only strengthen its reporting arrangements, but widens the public engagement process. This is crucial in putting the role of an integrated health system that serves Wales collectively into place. This amendment would also help to promote collaboration between local health boards and local authorities with an emphasis on schooling and engagement. Central to this is ensuring that public health messaging from health boards and the effective marketing of public health initiatives is taken forward in collaboration with educational bodies. For example, when we seek to improve the health and well-being of young persons, we must recognise that inactivity is a hidden killer, contributing to one in six deaths in the UK, the same level as smoking. More than one in three people in Wales are inactive, failing to be active for more than 30 minutes a week. We already know that physically inactive individuals spend an average of 38 per cent more days in hospital, they make 5.5 per cent more GP visits, and access 13 per cent more specialist services and 12 per cent more nurse visits than an active individual. Yet the Welsh Government, despite its list of commitments to increase physical participation amongst Wales’s population, has cut its funding to physical activity programmes.
In the 2016-17 budget, the Welsh Government cut the delivery of effective sports and physical activity programmes from £26,891,000 to £22 million. This represents a real-terms decrease of 7 per cent. And the number of hours dedicated to PE at primary school level have also declined across Wales. In 2010-11, an average of 115 minutes per week were spent on PE lessons at primary school level. However, the latest statistics show that this currently stands at 100 minutes in 2014-15, and this is in contrast to the noted successes of the UK Government, who introduced the PE and sport premium, which was designed to help primary schools improve the quality of the PE and sports activity they offer their pupils, and they have invested over £450 million during the last three academic years.
This amendment would reinforce the importance of public health being integrated and promotes collaborative working, which, in turn, would lead to a more effective use of the budget and would ensure greater outcomes. Furthermore, it will drive a partnership between health professionals and schools to ensure that factors such as nutrition are also considered when schools are putting forward their lunch menus, because, despite all the talk, currently, healthy eating guidelines are not being achieved by many people in Wales. Guidelines promote eating at least five portions of fruit and vegetables each day with meals based on starchy carbohydrates like potatoes, rice, and pasta. However, these guidelines merely promote having a balanced diet. With regard to tackling obesity, there should be more detailed advice and targeted support available so people at risk of obesity can make informed decisions about their nutrition.
Make no mistake: messaging to children, young people, and, indeed, adults, needs to step up in effectiveness and cohesion. For example, we should note that the Welsh health survey, which measures the daily consumption of fruit and vegetables as an indicator of health and well-being, shows that just one in three people eat the recommended amount of fruit and vegetables each day, and there are questions as to whether current guidelines on healthy eating are actually able to promote healthy lifestyles and tackle obesity. The National Obesity Forum has produced a damning report that highlights that current dietary guidelines are failing to tackle the ever-growing challenge of obesity. The report criticises existing guidelines that promote low-fat diets and high-carbohydrate intake in order to have a balanced diet. Creative, informative, and motivational messaging is critical to helping to improve public health in Wales, and we need to ensure that public health messaging from health boards and effective marketing of public health initiatives are taken forward in collaboration with educational bodies.
This amendment, Minister, will also ensure greater data collection is taken forward in terms of identifying the parameters that allow better public health outcomes. Finally, this amendment will require Ministers to report progress to the National Assembly for Wales on a yearly basis and, as such, allow all Members here to benchmark and scrutinise Welsh Government progress in improving public health for the youngest in our society, and I ask Members to support it.
Rhun ap Iorwerth
Plaid Cymru
4:44,
9 May 2017
Plaid Cymru is pleased to support these amendments. We often hear about the difficulties that patients of all ages face when there is a variety of public bodies responsible for the services that they receive. This, of course, includes young people. They are no different. Indeed, one could argue that they are in more complex positions on occasion, if you add the school or educational institution as another layer of public service that plays a part in decisions on care and support for young persons.
I, like many here, I’m sure, have dealt with a number of cases in my Constituency relating to mental health problems suffered by young people—some of them very serious problems—and the role of the school in the treatment and care provided is often centrally important. Therefore, collaboration is important. It doesn’t always happen as we would like to see it happen, and this Amendment would at least lead to the need to report back on the level of collaboration that currently exists. I’m also pleased to see that the amendment specifically notes that reports should refer to obesity levels—something that we’ve already discussed here this afternoon—and to nutrition. It also emphasises the need for public health messages to be communicated effectively to young people, and communicated in a way that is seen as relevant to young people. Therefore, we are happy to support these amendments.
Jenny Rathbone
Labour
4:46,
9 May 2017
I was very struck by the points made by Angela Burns, and, before the Minister replies, I wondered if she could say whether the Government supports the approach of the Soil Association certification of school meals, and their approach to good food for all, which ensures that children are eating freshly produced produce rather than stuff that’s being brought in and cooked from chilled, and also with an emphasis on the schools actually ensuring that children are encouraged to eat new vegetables and fruit, and taste things that they may not get at home.
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
I call on the Minister, Rebecca Evans.
Rebecca Evans
Labour
Thank you, and I thank Angela Burns for bringing forward the amendments in this group, and I do recognise the intention behind the amendments and share the view that improving and protecting the health and well-being of our young people should be at the forefront of public health policy in Wales, and, in response to Jenny Rathbone’s concerns as well, I would refer all Members to the letter that I sent recently to all Members of the National Assembly for Wales, which outlined our approach to nutritional standards, both in school settings and also hospital settings, and extending them to early years settings and care home settings in future as well.
I would, with regard to this Amendment, however, emphasise that safeguarding the health of children and young people is already a central theme right across the Bill and across other policies and legislation. The Bill provides a series of important protections for children, for example by restricting smoking in settings such as school grounds and public playgrounds, and by protecting children from the potential harms caused by intimate piercing. In addition, the long-term focus of health impact assessments will be another important way of ensuring that the future health and well-being of children and young people is protected.
Whilst I understand the good intentions behind these amendments, I believe they are inappropriate for a number of reasons. The well-being of future generations Act requires a public body in Wales to collaborate with others to meet its objectives and also to report annually on the progress made in meeting its objectives. Among the objectives that the public bodies listed in Angela Burns’s amendment should be considering and reporting on are public health issues relevant to young people, such as obesity, nutrition and mental health. These amendments would, therefore, effectively duplicate requirements in other legislation. Elements of these amendments also seem to duplicate other work being taken forward under this Bill—for example through the national obesity strategy that will be developed as a result of the amendments agreed earlier this afternoon.
The national obesity strategy amendments require the Welsh Ministers to publish a strategy on preventing obesity and reducing obesity levels in Wales, and this would include—but wouldn’t be limited to—obesity levels in young people. In addition, the Cabinet Secretary for Health, Well-being and Sport has committed to developing a children’s health plan to describe the national priority areas that health services should be addressing to improve outcomes for children and young people in Wales. It’s envisaged that the plan will be published for consultation before the end of the year, and an annual progress report will also be published. This important work will provide another way of achieving the desired effect of these amendments, and of providing strategic direction in a broader sense than these amendments would achieve.
Finally, in terms of outcomes, there’s already a range of mechanisms in place in Wales that enable us to monitor trends in the health and well-being of young people and children. For example, the annual reports of the chief medical officer and various surveys provide us with valuable information in this regard. So, taking all of these things together, the amendments in this group risk duplicating some of the existing and planned work without adding extra value, and for these reasons I’m unable to support the amendments in this group and would ask Members to reject them.
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
4:50,
9 May 2017
I call on Angela Burns to reply to the debate. Angela Burns.
Angela Burns
Conservative
Thank you very much indeed. I’m very disappointed to have your response, Minister. I do not believe that the fragmented approach that you’re having of looking at the various outcomes for child health will have the desired effect of these amendments. Time and time and time again this Assembly sits and talks about public health issues. We all bang on about how much smoking people are doing, how overweight people are, how unhealthy we are, and what a time bomb it is to the future of our NHS and how we’re going to have to deal, in five, 10, 15 and 20 years’ time with an increase in chronic conditions that will—to be frank—cripple the NHS if we’re not careful. [Interruption.] Sorry, I have a real frog in my throat today. I wish it would go. Yet, this simple Amendment is actually targeted at our young people—the future of Wales. This simple amendment asks that, every year, the Welsh Government should bring forward to this Chamber, for all of these Assembly Members who talk on this issue week after week, month after month, year after year, the ability to actually look at whether or not we are delivering true public health measures to young people, to make a difference, to alleviate that time bomb that may be going off in five or 10 years’ time.
There are varying pieces of legislation out there at the moment. You know, we can run through them all: the well-being of future generations Act, the imminent additional learning needs Bill, this Bill. Let me just take one: the healthy eating Measure. I remember being an Assembly Member and sitting on the committee that brought that forward. Has it actually made a significant difference to the food quality in schools in Wales? No. My children have just left primary school, and for the years that they were there, as they were in a school that didn’t have its own kitchen and had to have everything shipped in, they never saw a green vegetable. Thankfully, they had a parent who would make them eat broccoli in the evenings, but if I didn’t do that, they wouldn’t know what a green vegetable is. So, we’re not—despite all of our intent and our bits of legislation squirrelled away here and squirrelled away there, we are losing that focus. So, this amendment was purely to bring that focus.
I am very sad that you’ve decided that you can’t accept it, because the Welsh Government has never had a problem with the fragmentation of policy intent in numerous Bills, and you’ve never had a problem before with repetition. So, why you’ve got a problem on this issue, I think, is really sad, and I believe you’re missing a trick, and we are going to lose focus on really making that change to the lives of young people in Wales.
Elin Jones
Plaid Cymru
4:53,
9 May 2017
If Amendment 33 is not agreed to, amendment 34 falls. The question is that amendment 33 be agreed to. Does any Member object? [Objection.] We’ll proceed to an electronic vote. Open the vote. Close the vote. In favour 24, no abstentions, and 27 against. Therefore, the amendment is not agreed.
Division number 321
Amendment 33
As a bill passes through Parliament, MPs and peers may suggest amendments - or changes - which they believe will improve the quality of the legislation.
Many hundreds of amendments are proposed by members to major bills as they pass through committee stage, report stage and third reading in both Houses of Parliament.
In the end only a handful of amendments will be incorporated into any bill.
The Speaker - or the chairman in the case of standing committees - has the power to select which amendments should be debated.
Ministers make up the Government and almost all are members of the House of Lords or the House of Commons. There are three main types of Minister. Departmental Ministers are in charge of Government Departments. The Government is divided into different Departments which have responsibilities for different areas. For example the Treasury is in charge of Government spending. Departmental Ministers in the Cabinet are generally called 'Secretary of State' but some have special titles such as Chancellor of the Exchequer. Ministers of State and Junior Ministers assist the ministers in charge of the department. They normally have responsibility for a particular area within the department and are sometimes given a title that reflects this - for example Minister of Transport.
As a bill passes through Parliament, MPs and peers may suggest amendments - or changes - which they believe will improve the quality of the legislation.
Many hundreds of amendments are proposed by members to major bills as they pass through committee stage, report stage and third reading in both Houses of Parliament.
In the end only a handful of amendments will be incorporated into any bill.
The Speaker - or the chairman in the case of standing committees - has the power to select which amendments should be debated.
The Conservatives are a centre-right political party in the UK, founded in the 1830s. They are also known as the Tory party.
With a lower-case ‘c’, ‘conservative’ is an adjective which implies a dislike of change, and a preference for traditional values.
In a general election, each Constituency chooses an MP to represent them. MPs have a responsibility to represnt the views of the Constituency in the House of Commons. There are 650 Constituencies, and thus 650 MPs. A citizen of a Constituency is known as a Constituent
The cabinet is the group of twenty or so (and no more than 22) senior government ministers who are responsible for running the departments of state and deciding government policy.
It is chaired by the prime minister.
The cabinet is bound by collective responsibility, which means that all its members must abide by and defend the decisions it takes, despite any private doubts that they might have.
Cabinet ministers are appointed by the prime minister and chosen from MPs or peers of the governing party.
However, during periods of national emergency, or when no single party gains a large enough majority to govern alone, coalition governments have been formed with cabinets containing members from more than one political party.
War cabinets have sometimes been formed with a much smaller membership than the full cabinet.
From time to time the prime minister will reorganise the cabinet in order to bring in new members, or to move existing members around. This reorganisation is known as a cabinet re-shuffle.
The cabinet normally meets once a week in the cabinet room at Downing Street.
A proposal for new legislation that is debated by Parliament.
The House of Commons votes by dividing. Those voting Aye (yes) to any proposition walk through the division lobby to the right of the Speaker and those voting no through the lobby to the left. In each of the lobbies there are desks occupied by Clerks who tick Members' names off division lists as they pass through. Then at the exit doors the Members are counted by two Members acting as tellers. The Speaker calls for a vote by announcing "Clear the Lobbies". In the House of Lords "Clear the Bar" is called. Division Bells ring throughout the building and the police direct all Strangers to leave the vicinity of the Members’ Lobby. They also walk through the public rooms of the House shouting "division". MPs have eight minutes to get to the Division Lobby before the doors are closed. Members make their way to the Chamber, where Whips are on hand to remind the uncertain which way, if any, their party is voting. Meanwhile the Clerks who will take the names of those voting have taken their place at the high tables with the alphabetical lists of MPs' names on which ticks are made to record the vote. When the tellers are ready the counting process begins - the recording of names by the Clerk and the counting of heads by the tellers. When both lobbies have been counted and the figures entered on a card this is given to the Speaker who reads the figures and announces "So the Ayes [or Noes] have it". In the House of Lords the process is the same except that the Lobbies are called the Contents Lobby and the Not Contents Lobby. Unlike many other legislatures, the House of Commons and the House of Lords have not adopted a mechanical or electronic means of voting. This was considered in 1998 but rejected. Divisions rarely take less than ten minutes and those where most Members are voting usually take about fifteen. Further information can be obtained from factsheet P9 at the UK Parliament site.