Lord Callanan: The noble Lord should be careful of jumping to conclusions. I have not seen the programme, but my officials have. They have engaged extensively with forestry experts and Canadian officials following the programme, and the officials’ conclusion is that the “Panorama” programme provided an inaccurate representation of practices by the forestry and biomass sector on the ground.
Lord Callanan: I have to say that I am really not sure what the noble Baroness is talking about. There is a national grid. Electricity is transported from all parts of the country to other parts, as demand varies. That is the whole principle of a grid.
Lord Callanan: Again, the noble Baroness is jumping to conclusions before the investigation has proceeded. Based on the evidence reviewed to date, Ofgem has not established any non-compliance with the scheme. But the investigation is continuing and I would caution noble Lords to wait for the outcome from the independent regulator.
Lord Callanan: It is because the sustainability criteria say that the biomass has to come from sustainable sources. Most of it is by-product from normal sustainable commercial forests.
Lord Callanan: Yes.
Lord Callanan: As somebody famous once remarked, recollection of facts may vary. Forgive me if I do not necessarily take as absolute fact the statements of some Canadian environmentalists. Officials have looked into it. Ofgem is investigating whether the biomass is sustainable or not. Let us wait for the outcome of that investigation.
Lord Callanan: The noble Lord was probably in the other place when the regulations and laws for Ofgem were passed. It is an independent regulator; that is the whole principle of it. Until I see any evidence that it is not carrying out its job satisfactorily, I will continue to have confidence in it.
Lord Callanan: I refer the noble Baroness to the answers I have given to previous questions. There are other biomass operations that fulfil the sustainability criteria. If any evidence is produced and if the noble Baroness has any evidence, I would be delighted to pass it on, but until then we should trust what they say.
Lord Callanan: My Lords, I have answered the Question properly. Ofgem is an independent regulator and takes these matters extremely seriously. I have spoken to the chief executive of Ofgem about it and I have spoken to officials who have investigated it, so I feel that I have discharged my duties on this one.
Lord Callanan: That was not the question I was asked, but let me tackle the question from the noble Baroness. Of course, it is perfectly within anybody’s rights to set up a private wire supply and their own community generation if they wish, but I think the noble Baroness will find that the vast majority of those schemes also want to be connected to the national grid for cases where it does not work.
Lord Callanan: My Lords, I thank everyone who contributed to today’s debate. I will respond to some of the points that have been made. First, we take Dispatch Box commitments extremely seriously. I reiterate that this Government will not row back on our world-leading environmental protections, as I mentioned in my opening remarks. To respond directly to the point made by the noble Lords, Lord Krebs and...
Lord Callanan: My Lords, with the leave of the House, I will also speak to Motion B. The House will be pleased to know that I can be brief again today. We have extensively debated these issues on a number of occasions. The reality is that the House of Commons has considered this Bill once more and has come to the same conclusions as previously, again with significant majorities. This is now the third time...
Lord Callanan: My Lords, I beg to move the Motion standing in my name on the Order Paper.
Lord Callanan: My Lords, my noble friend is being slightly mischievous on this. The question he asks is not in any way related to the statutory instrument debated last week, but I would be happy to have a separate conversation with him about it. Motion agreed.
Lord Callanan: My Lords, we have had this debate numerous times now, so the House will be delighted to know that I can keep my response fairly brief. I have responded to all the points made previously because noble Lords have repeated many of the points that they made in earlier debates. Interestingly, the one person who did not repeat the points that he made in earlier debates was the noble Lord, Lord Fox;...
Lord Callanan: My Lords, with the leave of the House, at the same time as moving Motion A I will speak to Motion B. The retained EU law Bill has once again returned to this House from the other place. I am pleased to say that the other place has accepted the final drafting change to Amendment 16, so that matter is now closed. This amendment significantly adds to the scrutiny that Parliament can conduct on...
Lord Callanan: My Lords, we have once again had a reasonably full debate on these matters, so the House will be relieved that I will keep my response brief. We have largely covered many of these points before, so we do not need to repeat them. Briefly, in response to the noble Baroness, Lady O’Grady, I restate the view of the Government that this Bill is not about sacking workers, and nor is it about...
Lord Callanan: My Lords, in moving Motion C, with the leave of the House, I will also speak to Motion D. Motions C and D in my name cover this House’s Amendments 4, 5, 6 and 7, which removed key parts of the legislation that are necessary to make it effective and to ensure that minimum service levels can in fact be achieved. It is therefore unsurprising that the other place resolved against these...
Lord Callanan: My Lords, I thank all those who have contributed. The House will be pleased to know that I do not intend to detain noble Lords for very long. We have debated these matters extensively on a number of occasions in a very rigorous manner, so I do not intend to repeat all the arguments. But, let me just say very briefly, particularly in response to the noble and learned Lord, Lord Thomas, that we...
Lord Callanan: My Lords, with the leave of the House I will also speak to Motion B. I will speak to both the Motions to not insist on these amendments and to resist Motions A1 and B1, which are amendments in lieu tabled by the noble and learned Lord, Lord Thomas, and the noble Lord, Lord Fox. I am delighted to be in the Chamber again following the consideration of this House’s amendments to the Bill in...
