Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords—
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I am grateful to the Chief Whip for her intervention. Despite the Ministerial and other Salaries Act, the present Cabinet consists of 22 members: the quad—the Prime Minister, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, the Chief Secretary and the Lord President of the Council— and 18 Secretaries of State, but fortunately one of them is also Lord Chancellor, who is covered by a separate...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, we are talking about what the Secretary of State considers. I wonder whether the difficulty could be resolved if the Minister were to state formally, on the record in Hansard, that the Secretary of State must consider that, “for objective reasons the requirement is strictly” necessary.
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I do not propose—indeed I am not qualified—to comment on the ruling of the European Court of Justice which has made it necessary to introduce the legislation that we are considering. But as a consequence of what I learnt as a member of the Joint Committee for pre-legislative scrutiny of the Government’s draft communications data Bill, chaired by my noble friend Lord...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I was a member of the Joint Committee which scrutinised the draft communications data Bill. I am sure that all members of that committee would attach great importance to restoring the position that we thought we were in before this. For that reason, I, and I think many colleagues on the Cross Benches, will support the Bill. The sunset clause which has been described will make it...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I welcome the Labour Party report, which is full of interesting and well thought-out ideas and I congratulate the noble Baroness, Lady Taylor, and Lord Grenfell on chairing that working group. As it turns out that I shall not be able to stay until the end of the debate, I shall spare your Lordships the benefit of my observations on this occasion confident that another occasion will...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I shall be brief. The core purposes of this Bill are that there should be an “in or out” referendum. It is not about what the result of that referendum should be; it is about whether there should be a referendum and that it should be before the end of 2017. This amendment has no bearing on those purposes. It leaves them unaffected. It requires the Government in certain...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, my knowledge of the Welsh language is even more spectacularly uncertain than that of the noble Lord, Lord Trefgarne. Is the language in Amendment 45 a precise translation of the amended version of the question?
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: This amendment is moved as a consequence of the passage of Amendment 1. If this amendment is accepted, Amendment 31 falls and I should not move it. Amendment 28 agreed. Amendments 29 and 30 not moved.
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, my modest, innocent little amendment has given rise to a long, interesting and wide-ranging debate, and after more than two hours I do not propose to try to deal with every point. We are being told that the Bill must pass unamended to go back to the House of Commons in order to be concluded in time to be passed into legislation in this Session. As to that, although I am not an...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I hope that I can be reasonably brief in moving the amendment. We have a long day ahead of us. The amendment does not bear on the issue of whether a referendum on United Kingdom membership of the European Union should be held. Nor does it bear on the date at which or by which such a referendum should be held. Thus it does not call into question the principal purposes of the Bill. It...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, my noble friend Lord Hennessy of Nympsfield has been taking a keen interest in the Civil Service, its activities and personnel, for nearly 50 years. That interest has become steadily more benign and supportive over the years. We all mellow with age. At least we can be grateful to him for raising the subject and giving us an opportunity to debate it. With time being very short, I...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I do not intend to spend time today on the intra-party or inter-party shenanigans of this Bill. I propose to underline only two points, which have already, of course, been made in this debate. There are only about three points to be made throughout the debate. On the first point, the Prime Minister has made a clear commitment that if he returns to office after the election next year...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, like the noble Lord, Lord Kerr, I was a Permanent Secretary for some 10 years and, unlike him, was a civil servant. I do not remember in that period ever being lobbied as a Permanent Secretary, but of course lobbying went on among the grades immediately below mine. This debate has therefore shown that these matters must be the subject of a new amendment on Report that resolves the...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I declare an interest as one who formerly had the custodianship of these papers. I can confirm that the evidence was taken by Lord Denning on the specific understanding that it would never be published. I think that one would need to be very bold to go back on that, certainly while people who gave evidence to the Denning inquiry or who were involved in events are still alive, and...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I am grateful to noble Lords who have taken part in this brief debate. I did not expect to please the noble Lord, Lord Lester, but I do not myself think that the amendment deserves the obloquy that he attempts to throw upon it. None the less, given the views that have been expressed, I do not think that it would be right to force a Division. Therefore, with some regret, I beg leave...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I move the amendment standing in my name and in the names of my noble and learned friend Lord Mackay of Clashfern and my noble friends Lady Williams of Crosby and Lord Lea of Crondall—if a Cross-Bencher may be allowed to have noble friends in all parts of the House. What are the purposes of this amendment? The preamble makes it clear that it is limited to legislation regulating or...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I am in something of a dilemma, because Amendment 71 is consequential on Amendment 85, which is the substantive amendment, but it has been agreed between the usual channels that Amendment 85 will be for debate on Wednesday afternoon. If it is for the convenience of the House that we should not be too late—much too late—rising tonight, I will be content not to move Amendment 71...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, as both the noble Lord, Lord Phillips, and the noble Marquess, Lord Lothian, referred to Amendment 46, which is in my name, I will take this opportunity to speak to it. The Bill reminds me irresistibly of Humpty Dumpty, as other noble Lords have said it does them. Your Lordships will remember that, from his seat on the wall, Humpty Dumpty said to Alice: “When I use a word, it...
Lord Armstrong of Ilminster: My Lords, I have hesitated to venture to add to the hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of words which have been spoken and written about the noble Baroness, Lady Thatcher, these past three days but perhaps something should be said from the perspective of one who, as a civil servant and Secretary to the Cabinet, worked closely for and with her for eight of the 11 and a half years for...
