Sir Eric Geddes: I beg to move, "That the Bill be now read a second time." I propose to deal with this Bill, first, as to the problem which confronts the Government; secondly, as to the Government's conception of the scope of the Ministry of Ways and Communications; thirdly, to give certain detailed information as to the financial position of the various transportation services to-day; and, finally, as...
Sir Eric Geddes: No; I am not including shipping. [HON. MEMBERS: "It will come!," and "Why not?"]
Sir Eric Geddes: It is not proposed to include shipping. The country must trust someone or somebody to get co-ordination, and to get the fullest possible utilisation of everything the country possesses. The railway interest is a community interest. Another thing is that we cannot wait. We are not rich now. We are poor. We are losing a large sum every day. Agriculture has got to be developed. Apart from the...
Sir Eric Geddes: It is so.
Sir Eric Geddes: They cannot exist by themselves, and already I am receiving applications from all sides for advice. They know that I have got a certain number, a small staff, of technical experts, who are helping me, and I am asked for advice on all sides about these undertakings. It has been suggested that the great sixty-centimetre Decauville organisation in France might be brought over here and with...
Sir Eric Geddes: I have only got the figures as between owned and not owned. Non-railway-owned canals were subsidised, in 1918, by the State to the extent of £670,000. The railway-owned canals, of course, come in under the general guarantee. That £670,000 which was paid in 1918 is more than the total net income on the canals in 1905, and the carrying companies are receiving great help too. There are those...
Sir Eric Geddes: There is no estimate of the actual cost, but from our experience of actual experiments it is a very remunerative proposition. But it is not only in reducing the price of the current that we get an advantage. The greatest advantage of electricity is in getting greater density of traffic over the line, so that there is a still further advantage in developing the district that you electrify, and...
Sir Eric Geddes: On the other hand, dealing particularly with the provisions of Clause 4, Sub-section (1), paragraphs (e) and (f), as regards (e) the Government will definitely seek power in the Bill to acquire, by purchase or hire, and to maintain, work or lease privately-owned railway wagons on terms, failing agreement, to be settled by the Railway and Canal Commission under the provision of Clause 3,...
Sir Eric Geddes: No; it does not.
Sir Eric Geddes: The wagons and the undertakings will become the property of the Government.
Sir Eric Geddes: They will belong to the Government, and the Government will have to seek powers at the end of two years to deal with the whole question of transportation. As regards the general conception of the final organisation, I am sure the House will realise that it is very difficult to give full details at this stage, but I may say that, as regards Ireland, it, is proposed there, on account of the...
Sir Eric Geddes: It will be a branch of the Ministry here. All local matters of purely local interest will be dealt with there. If matters of great importance have to be discussed, it will be the intention of the Minister, or the senior high technical officers, to go over to Dublin to discuss them.
Sir Eric Geddes: No.
Sir Eric Geddes: Yes; but they all come under the same Ministry.
Sir Eric Geddes: It applies everywhere. Then, as regards railways during the two years, we shall continue some such organisation as existed during the War. I hope it will be possible to modify it to some extent, in order to allow the senior railway officials, who have spent their time in London, to get back to attend to the management of their lines; but it is not proposed to alter that at the present time....
Sir Eric Geddes: The present Railway Executive, or, as I have endeavoured to explain, some body more or less like it, so long as the companies remain in their present position, will have to continue, and in the future, when we reach the more permanent state of railways and of the transportation of the country generally, I think some body of Commissioners will be necessary. I do not think it would be a...
Sir Eric Geddes: Yes; I propose to deal with it.
Sir Eric Geddes: It was not intended to be a concession; it was a statement of fact.
Sir Eric Geddes: May I inquire if this communication was signed by me?
Sir Eric Geddes: I think I can assure the House and the hon. Member that there is a mistake. Speaking as far as one can, and speaking from my recollection, there has been no bribe and there has been no such letter sent. No such bribe has been offered. Bribe is a very extreme word to use. There has been no offer of the kind, and no promise of the kind.