Eric Joyce: I thank the hon. Member for his intervention. I think that the technical situation is that the case will continue even if Kenya withdraws, although my instinct is that it will be difficult to do anything in that situation. I suppose the ICC may criticise the President’s absence and then carry on with the trial. Theoretically, and it is pretty theoretical, the African nations that are...
Eric Joyce: I take the Minister’s point about the issues to do with mistreatment or otherwise, but does he agree that there is not really a precedent for holding someone, ostensibly as a prisoner of war, for 11 years? The only precedent that I can think of is the gulags after the second world war; that is not something that we would care to accept as a common practice.
Eric Joyce: It is not my intention to be overtly critical of the ICC. Indeed, the Minister will be aware that Rwanda has successfully taken custody of Bosco Ntaganda, and Rwanda, like Kenya, regards the ICC as important. The processes are not exactly as we would understand them in the UK, and it would be a mistake to think that they were in all respects. For example, it is possible to be held by the ICC...
Eric Joyce: I do not intend to be critical of the ICC per se. I referred to the fact that the ICC’s remit effectively covers the whole world, because permanent members of the Security Council can refer cases to it whether or not the country involved is a member. Technically, therefore, the ICC covers China, Russia and anywhere else, but those countries might not consider it in their interest, and I can...
Eric Joyce: It is difficult to overstate the importance of Kenya to the United Kingdom and, indeed, the wider international community. Perhaps first and foremost, Kenya is at the centre of international efforts to ensure the security of our own citizens. Citizens of Kenya have played a high price for that role and for their pivotal location in the world in recent years, from the US embassy bombing in...
Eric Joyce: The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. We all agree with the international rule of law and we see that the ICC has a role, but we also understand that there is an even larger public benefit at play across the world. It is for politicians to fix this. We benefit enormously as a nation from our relationship with Kenya, so this is not entirely altruistic, but those of us who care about African...
Eric Joyce: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs if he will make representations to the Government of the Democratic Republic of Congo in respect of the renewed civil war in the eastern Democratic Republic of Congo.
Eric Joyce: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills whether the Government plans to sign up to the London-based Extractive Industries Transparency Initiative.
Eric Joyce: It occurs to me that some large newspaper organisations, such as the Johnston Press—The Falkirk Herald, the original Johnston Press newspaper, is in my constituency—are getting rid of editors in some cases. Does he agree that that does not seem like a good idea, either?
Eric Joyce: I have listened carefully to what hon. Members have said. I have no strongly formed views on what is being proposed that I cannot change in most respects. I listened carefully to my right hon. Friend the Member for Sheffield, Brightside and Hillsborough (Mr Blunkett) and believe that there is room for considerably more compromise than we have seen in the first few days since the Leveson...
Eric Joyce: I suppose that what The Spectator and its editor meant was that they would not take part in that whole structure, and so they would then be regulated directly by Ofcom as per the recommendations of Leveson.
Eric Joyce: We have heard a great deal about the great and good so far in this debate, and it has been interesting, but does the right hon. Gentleman think that sometimes Leveson might just say something—it might actually be so—but that we might take a different view?
Eric Joyce: We just might disagree.
Eric Joyce: It is a privilege to speak under your chairmanship, Mr Benton, and in front of these magnificent new clock displays, as described. I am interested in UK-listed mining companies—other hon. Members will be interested, because of the UK dimensions of these companies’ operations—primarily because I have spent a fair amount of time in developing countries and seen that the way mining...
Eric Joyce: My hon. Friend is absolutely correct. There is no argument—it is simply a fact that is part of the tragedy of the DRC. It has applied to join the extractive industries transparency initiative, but at this stage it could not possibly do so. There is eternal tension between wanting companies to come into something like the EITI, and saying that if it takes anyone, it will become a daft badge...
Eric Joyce: With respect to my hon. Friend, that is the point: there is a fundamental problem with the legislation. What many people have argued is that there is a flaw with the 2006 Act, so it is not a case of saying, “If a problem arises”. There is a problem and we need to sort it out.
Eric Joyce: I thank the hon. Member for Congleton (Fiona Bruce) for an excellent deconstruction of the problem, and other hon. Members for taking so many interventions—which makes it rather more difficult to make an original point at this stage. I just want to say one thing, which I think that there is time for. The hon. Lady and other hon. Members focused on the public benefit test itself and on how...
