Mr Norman Fowler: That, too, supports what I am saying. I hope that my hon. Friend will be able to develop that later. I was explaining the defects of the B.B.C. programmes complaints commission. The major defect is in what it seems to the public to be, why it seems to have been set up. Almost universally in the Press it has been regarded as a pre-emptive strike by the B.B.C. to prevent a broadcasting...
Mr Norman Fowler: The hon. Gentleman makes that point, but it is a significant fact that there is virtual unanimity among the newspapers in supporting the idea of a broadcasting council.
Mr Norman Fowler: rose—
Mr Norman Fowler: Rubbish.
Mr Norman Fowler: The hon. and learned Gentleman is developing slightly the guilt-by-association kind of argument. Matters of taste are considered by the Press Council. Does he not agree that programmes which show, for example, violence in perhaps an extreme way or racial prejudice would come within this area, which is a much more important area than the hon. and learned Gentleman suggests?
Mr Norman Fowler: The hon. Member for Erith and Crayford (Mr. Wellbeloved) will forgive me if I do not follow exactly the points he has raised but deal with one or two other aspects of the Metropolitan Police. When we tot up the costs of the Metropolitan Police, we usually talk about the costs of the C.I.D., of traffic and of patrols. I draw attention to another cost —the growing cost to the police involved...
Mr Norman Fowler: There is a great deal of truth in that. I have sympathy with what the hon. Gentleman says, but if he will excuse me I will confine myself to the question of the gathering of information. We must have certain basic information if we are to put forward policies to tackle the situation. I have confined myself to robbery because that is perhaps one of the more dramatic examples, but one can...
Mr Norman Fowler: rose—
Mr Norman Fowler: I do not know the details, but I suggest that the hon. Gentleman is making a serious allegation against policemen. I should have thought that everyone would know what he is talking about. Has he any evidence to substantiate the charge he is making?
Mr Norman Fowler: On what evidence?
Mr Norman Fowler: One obvious answer to that is that someone else involved in the accident or incident might think it was worth while to ring up the Press.
Mr Norman Fowler: Will my right hon. Friend recognise that there is concern about the question of news generally, and will he also recognise the importance of commercial radio providing a good news service? Does he not agree that a central news station is the best way of providing such a service, and will he totally disregard the radio Luddites who are trying to stand in the way of this advance?
Mr Norman Fowler: I rise to raise a subject of which I have given the Chair notice and notice of which I have also given to my hon. and learned Friend the Under-Secretary, and that is the state of prisons in England and Wales. A great deal of attention has been given in the Press to the state of penal policy in this country and the state of the prisons in England and Wales, and by way of illustration one has...
Mr Norman Fowler: While I reject all that the hon. Member for Cornwall, North (Mr. Pardoe) said about cannabis, may I ask whether my hon. Friend has noticed the disturbing reports that there is an increasing use of Chinese heroin in this country? Does not he agree that, if those reports are true, the position is extremely serious as it implies a professionally-organised trade in the drug? Will he, therefore,...
Mr Norman Fowler: asked the Minister for the Civil Service whether he is satisfied with the present distribution between Departments of Government Press and information officers; and if he will make a statement.
Mr Norman Fowler: While thanking my hon. Friend for that reply, may I ask him whether he would not agree that there is a most extraordinary discrepancy in the facts that he has given? Is he aware that the Defence Department has 139 Press and information officers yet a major Department like the Home Office can get on with under 20?
Mr Norman Fowler: Speaking as a non-member of the Committee, I feel that this is an extremely valuable report and anything I say should be taken in the context of the dedication of those in the probation service to their job. The feature which comes out in this report is how little we know about the effect of the probation service. We know what it costs and its strength, but we know all too little about its...
Mr Norman Fowler: asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he will now make a further statement on the operation of the law concerning peaceful picketing.
Mr Norman Fowler: Will my right hon. Friend emphasise as widely as possible that these rules and regulations are not laid down by some remote Government Department but are the law of this country? Will he further emphasise that the rule of law is the hallmark of a democracy and that when it is ignored and challenged in this way, for whatever reason, it represents a basic combat against freedom in this country?
Mr Norman Fowler: asked the Minister of Posts and Telecommunications whether he will make a further statement on the effect that the introduction of commercial radio in Great Britain will have on local and national newspapers.