The amendments largely hang together, although amendment No. 49 is slightly different. Again, they are probing amendments. Having studied my phraseology when preparing my speaking notes, I realise that there are some faults, but the probing nature of the amendments stands. I hope that the Minister will explain a little more precisely how he thinks Natural England will operate and the precise meaning of some of the terms in schedule 1.

I shall deal first with amendment No. 51; amendment No. 56 is virtually the same but refers to the Commission for Rural Communities. In schedule 1, there appears to be a statement that Natural England will not be able to claim Crown immunity and should not be regarded as an agent or servant of the Crown except as far as nature reserves are concerned, subject to paragraph 22 of schedule 1. I find that somewhat odd. Amendment No. 51 would delete the words

“Natural England’s property is not to be regarded as property of, or held on behalf of, the Crown.”

Perhaps the Minister will tell me on whose behalf it is being held. If I am correct that “the Crown” is the phrase used to describe the state, the people or the   Government, who is Natural England holding the property on behalf of if not the Crown? Exactly the same point applies to amendment No. 56 for the Commission for Rural Communities.

Amendment No. 54 would delete paragraph 22. I do not necessarily want to delete all of it, but I would like to challenge the Minister to explain the Government’s position on nature reserves. My understanding is that Natural England will take over English Nature’s property portfolio, which includes some 17,000 hectares of national nature reserves which it owns and another 31,000 hectares that it leases. There will of course be other property, but I am particularly concerned about nature reserves.

There are many other ownership arrangements of national nature reserves. They are certainly not all vested in English Nature, nor should they be. My colleagues and I are unashamed advocates of the private ownership of such sites. That is a valuable way forward, and I would not want Natural England to see its role as being to acquire large swathes of the English countryside and turn them into nature reserves. I have a fundamental opposition to the concept of oases of conservation in the countryside.

Natural England’s function, like that of its predecessors, should be to promulgate pro-environment practices across the whole countryside, so that we improve the landscape and conserve the environment and wildlife, rather than just create oases. I hope that the Minister will confirm that Natural England will not be going out there to expand massively its ownership of national nature reserves.

We return, however, to the exception in paragraph 2 of schedule 1, which says:

“Subject to paragraph 22 (nature reserves), Natural England” will not receive Crown immunity. Implicit in that is the notion that somehow, on a nature reserve that Natural England owns, it will have Crown immunity. That implies that it will be able to breach, for example, the wildlife protection measures or the site of special scientific interest measures contained elsewhere in the Bill. I strongly suspect that the Government do not mean that, but that is my layman’s reading of the Bill.

It would be absurd if the very body set up to conserve and protect the natural environment were not required to comply with the same legislation as everybody else, especially as it is also the enforcement body for everybody else, as we shall discuss later. I am sure that the Government do not intend that. The purpose of the amendments is to get the Minister to explain what Natural England will do as regards national and other nature reserves.

Amendment No. 49 is distinct and reflects my hope that Natural England will not go out and acquire great swathes of countryside, inevitably using taxpayers’ money. My hon. Friend the Member for Hexham (Mr. Atkinson) referred to what is happening in Scotland; I know that you, Mr. Forth, would want neither the debate to turn to what is happening in Scotland nor to support what is happening in   Scotland. However, there is concern that public money is being used to buy up large swathes of Scotland and I would be concerned if that happened again.

Amendment No. 49 would restrict the power of Natural England to purchasing property purely for the purpose of administration. Although I want Natural England to be involved in management agreements, I would hope that that could be done by agreement with existing landowners, rather than by using large sums of taxpayers’ money to buy up great swathes of the countryside. Natural England should concentrate on encouraging good practice across the whole countryside.

Amendment No. 55 is similar, but even more important in respect of the Commission for Rural Communities. In your inordinate wisdom, Mr. Forth, you have grouped the amendments in such a way that I need now to refer to the commission—albeit obliquely, because we have not reached that part of the Bill. I note that the Liberal Democrat amendments to that part of the Bill will be discussed later.

As was said on Second Reading, we are concerned about the concept of having a Commission for Rural Communities. I am anxious to ensure that it, too, restricts its operations in the property market to those buildings necessary for administration. If we are to have a commission—I suspect that we will, regardless of our views or those of the Liberal Democrats—we need to ensure that its property dealings relate directly to its administrative needs. That is the purpose of amendment No. 55. I see an analogy with British Waterways, which has gone into property dealing per se rather than into making transactions that relate directly to the future of our waterways. I would not wish to see the Commission for Rural Communities going down that road. The amendment therefore seeks to restrict its property purchasing practices.

This group of amendments deals with two separate issues. The first is about nature reserves and what they are for, and whether it will be Natural England’s policy to continue buying them. I hope that it will not as I would rather that it entered into agreements with existing owners and managers. Related to that is the question of Crown immunity for anything done by Natural England on its nature reserves. The other issue is the distinct question of the purchase of property relating to administration. That is the reason for the two slightly different variations in this group of amendments.