Clause 18 - Provision of information to Board

Part of Police (Northern Ireland) Bill [Lords] – in a Public Bill Committee at 10:00 am on 27 February 2003.

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Photo of David Wilshire David Wilshire Conservative, Spelthorne 10:00, 27 February 2003

If I were the mover of the amendment, I would be better placed to answer my hon. Friend. I too am a little concerned about the phrase. The right hon. Member for Upper Bann may be a better person to answer such a question. I have flagged up the fact that to my mind, there can be a conflict of interest between the public good and the individual's good. The debate is about an individual's

interest, not the public interest. We must always be mindful of the reasonable silent majority of people who want to get on with their lives. We also must bear in mind that whatever we think about individuals, they have rights and need to be protected.

The right hon. Gentleman said that the amendment might tilt the balance too far in favour of the board and against the Chief Constable—and against the individual. I remain deeply worried that even with the safeguard of the amendment, if it were accepted, we would not have gone as far as we should. Perhaps the Minister will comment on that.

Even if the amendment were agreed, we would end up with a section of an Act that said that there would be no prohibition on releasing sensitive information if, for example, the Chief Constable were worried that the release of that information would do harm, whether to the public or the individual, and if he released stuff that the Act said that he ought not release. Subsection (6) of new section 33A does not say whether the public or the individual interest is covered by new section 76A(1), and it does not say that the Chief Constable may withhold the information; all it says is that the Chief Constable must tell someone that he has done it. However, by then the harm would have been done.

Even if the right hon. Gentleman's amendment were agreed, I do not believe that there would be sufficient safeguards for either the public or the individual interest. The situation is a mystery to me. These are day-to-day matters. As the Minister said in a previous debate, this is not about the formality of preparing a report or conducting an investigation. However, there may be some requirement to pass on information that might hurt somebody. The Minister has admitted that we are talking about an informal day-to-day activity, yet the Chief Constable will be forced to produce information that could harm somebody, and all he has to do is tell someone about that.

I would be interested to know why the Chief Constable is required to tell somebody. I can only assume that that is because the Secretary of State may need to make arrangements through the security services to ensure that the named person could have some physical protection so that they were not assassinated. Is that the purpose of passing on the information? I cannot see why it would matter otherwise, because the harm would already be done by releasing the information. In fact, it is admitted in the clause, as follows:

''information the disclosure of which would be likely to put an individual in danger''.

It is admitted in the Bill that that activity would put someone in danger, but no safeguard, other than telling the Secretary of State, is provided. That seems quite extraordinary.

Subsection (1) says:

''The Chief Constable shall supply the board with such information as the Board may require for the purposes of, or in connection with, the exercise of any of its functions.''

I know why that is included. I support the phrases ''in connection with'' and ''the exercise of . . . its functions'', which will stop the board going on a

fishing expedition to find juicy information that may or may not be relevant. Perhaps the Minister could tell us who would be the arbiter of a difference of opinion between the board, which may say that the requirement arose from the exercise of its functions, and the Chief Constable, who may say, ''Oh no it's not, it's going far beyond your remit; this is a fishing expedition.'' Nowhere do I see a reference to that—unless I have not read the rest of the Bill correctly or fully.

My hon. Friend the Member for Solihull (Mr. Taylor) asked about a conflict between interpretations, and here is a conflict between what is reasonable and unreasonable in the job that is being done. Nowhere do I see who would act as the referee. I am not a lawyer; I am simply trying to get my mind round whether judicial review applies to the issue, or whether this is an objective matter of having to disclose the information before deciding whether it is necessary to disclose it. If the board admits that it should not have asked for the information after it is disclosed, it cannot undisclose it.