NHS Reform & Health Care Professions Bill – in a Public Bill Committee at 4:45 pm on 6 December 2001.
Laura Moffatt
Labour, Crawley
4:45,
6 December 2001
I beg to move Amendment No. 158, in page 70, line 10, leave out from 'Commission' to end of line 11.
Mr Alan Hurst
Labour, Braintree
With this it will be convenient to discuss Amendment No. 159, in page 70, line 17, leave out sub-paragraphs (5) and (6).
Laura Moffatt
Labour, Crawley
In a debate earlier this week, the hon. Member for North-East Hertfordshire said:
''As with so much of the Bill, the Secretary of State does not give away any powers.''—[Official Report, Standing Committee A, 4 December 2001; c. 201.]
However, I hope that the amendments will enable the Under-Secretary to demonstrate that that is possible.
Amendment No. 158 relates to the consent of the Secretary of State to the appointment of the chief executive of the commission. It would take that power away from him and remove that requirement. Amendment No. 159 would do the same in respect of terms and conditions of employees of the commission. That would be a sensible thing to do.
Many of us have heard lots of interest expressed by local politicians and local people who have been involved in health campaigning for many years. We would be mad to assume that those people are going to walk away because there are new procedures in place and new ways of working. They will want to be engaged with what is going on. The amendments would help them to understand that the commission will be independent and able to do its job much better than ever the community health councils were able to do. I hope very much that my hon. Friend the Under-Secretary will accept the amendments.
Oliver Heald
Shadow Spokesperson (Health)
I warmly support the hon. Lady in her amendments and hope that when we come to schedule 7, on which I have tabled similar amendments, she will support me.
Richard Taylor
Independent, Wyre Forest
I thoroughly support the amendments but I am completely puzzled as to why we did not remove the same provision in schedule 2 of the Health Act 1999 in relation to the director of the Commission for Health Improvement.
Hazel Blears
Parliamentary Under-Secretary (Department of Health)
In response to the hon. Member for Wyre Forest, that has already been done in the Bill.
I welcome the amendments. It is important that the commission is independent; that was one of the main things that was said in the listening exercise. I confirm that the Government are prepared to accept my hon. Friend's amendments. They will strengthen the proposals, and make the commission more independent and more vibrant.
Amendment agreed to.
Amendment made: No. 159, in page 70, line 17, leave out sub-paragraphs (5) and (6).--[Laura Moffatt.]
It being Five o'clock, The Chairman proceeded, pursuant to Sessional Order D [20 November 2001] and the Order of the Committee [27 and 29 November 2001], to put forthwith the Questions necessary to dispose of the business to be concluded at that time.
Amendments made: No. 131, in page 72, line 16, leave out '45' and insert '45A'.
No. 132, in page 72, line 17, leave out '45A' and insert '45B'.--[Ms Blears.]
Motion made, and Question put, That this schedule, as amended, be the Sixth schedule to the Bill:--
The Committee divided: Ayes 9, Noes 3.
Division number 11
Adults Abused in Childhood — Schedule 6 - The Commission for Patient and Public Involvement in Health
Evan Harris
Liberal Democrat, Oxford West and Abingdon
On a point of order, Mr. Hurst. Are clauses 20 and 21 being voted on together?
Mr Alan Hurst
Labour, Braintree
Under the terms of the programming motion, all business must be disposed of by 5 o'clock.
The Committee divided: Ayes 7, Noes 4.
Division number 12
Adults Abused in Childhood — Schedule 6 - The Commission for Patient and Public Involvement in Health
Oliver Heald
Shadow Spokesperson (Health)
On a point of order, Mr. Hurst. We have been unable to discuss amendments Nos. 152, 190-197, new Clause 1, clause 20, which abolishes community health councils, clause 21, which covers joint working with the Prison Service, and new clause 1, which was tabled by the hon. Member for Oxford, West and Abingdon who speaks for the Liberal Democrats. Can you confirm that it is in order for us to return to those matters on Report? As Chairman of the Programming Sub-Committee, can you indicate that more time will be required than the programme motion provides?
Mr Alan Hurst
Labour, Braintree
On the second point, I speak only as the Programming Sub-Committee tells me so to do. On the first point, however, it will be possible to table further amendments on Report if the hon. Gentleman so wishes.
Further consideration adjourned.--[Mr. Fitzpatrick.]
Adjourned accordingly at Five minutes past Five o'clock till Tuesday 11 December at half-past Ten o'clock.
As a bill passes through Parliament, MPs and peers may suggest amendments - or changes - which they believe will improve the quality of the legislation.
Many hundreds of amendments are proposed by members to major bills as they pass through committee stage, report stage and third reading in both Houses of Parliament.
In the end only a handful of amendments will be incorporated into any bill.
The Speaker - or the chairman in the case of standing committees - has the power to select which amendments should be debated.
Secretary of State was originally the title given to the two officials who conducted the Royal Correspondence under Elizabeth I. Now it is the title held by some of the more important Government Ministers, for example the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs.
In a normal session there are up to ten standing committees on bills. Each has a chair and from 16 to 50 members. Standing committee members on bills are appointed afresh for each new bill by the Committee of Selection which is required to take account of the composition of the House of Commons (ie. party proportions) as well as the qualification of members to be nominated. The committees are chaired by a member of the Chairmen's Panel (whose members are appointed by the Speaker). In standing committees the Chairman has much the same function as the Speaker in the House of Commons. Like the Speaker, a chairman votes only in the event of a tie, and then usually in accordance with precedent. The committees consider each bill clause by clause and may make amendments. There are no standing committees in the House of Lords.
As a bill passes through Parliament, MPs and peers may suggest amendments - or changes - which they believe will improve the quality of the legislation.
Many hundreds of amendments are proposed by members to major bills as they pass through committee stage, report stage and third reading in both Houses of Parliament.
In the end only a handful of amendments will be incorporated into any bill.
The Speaker - or the chairman in the case of standing committees - has the power to select which amendments should be debated.
The House of Commons votes by dividing. Those voting Aye (yes) to any proposition walk through the division lobby to the right of the Speaker and those voting no through the lobby to the left. In each of the lobbies there are desks occupied by Clerks who tick Members' names off division lists as they pass through. Then at the exit doors the Members are counted by two Members acting as tellers. The Speaker calls for a vote by announcing "Clear the Lobbies". In the House of Lords "Clear the Bar" is called. Division Bells ring throughout the building and the police direct all Strangers to leave the vicinity of the Members’ Lobby. They also walk through the public rooms of the House shouting "division". MPs have eight minutes to get to the Division Lobby before the doors are closed. Members make their way to the Chamber, where Whips are on hand to remind the uncertain which way, if any, their party is voting. Meanwhile the Clerks who will take the names of those voting have taken their place at the high tables with the alphabetical lists of MPs' names on which ticks are made to record the vote. When the tellers are ready the counting process begins - the recording of names by the Clerk and the counting of heads by the tellers. When both lobbies have been counted and the figures entered on a card this is given to the Speaker who reads the figures and announces "So the Ayes [or Noes] have it". In the House of Lords the process is the same except that the Lobbies are called the Contents Lobby and the Not Contents Lobby. Unlike many other legislatures, the House of Commons and the House of Lords have not adopted a mechanical or electronic means of voting. This was considered in 1998 but rejected. Divisions rarely take less than ten minutes and those where most Members are voting usually take about fifteen. Further information can be obtained from factsheet P9 at the UK Parliament site.
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Printed in the margin next to each clause is a brief explanatory `side-note' giving details of what the effect of the clause will be.
During the committee stage of a bill, MPs examine these clauses in detail and may introduce new clauses of their own or table amendments to the existing clauses.
When a bill becomes an Act of Parliament, clauses become known as sections.
