Clause 3 - Conduct prohibited without a licence

Part of Private Security Industry Bill [Lords] – in a Public Bill Committee at 4:30 pm on 24 April 2001.

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Photo of John Bercow John Bercow Shadow Spokesperson (Home Affairs) 4:30, 24 April 2001

I beg to move amendment No. 39, in page 4, line 13, leave out subsection (6) and insert—

`(6) A person guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable—

(a) on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months or to a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum, or to both;

(b) on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years, or to a fine, or to both.'.

I endorse what has been said and welcome your return to the Chair, Mr. Winterton. That is in no sense an affront or discourtesy to your co-Chairman Mr. Benton, who chaired proceedings with alacrity, patience and humour this morning, but we knew that you would follow in similar vein this afternoon. We look forward to your continued Chairmanship.

I am pleased to speak in support of amendment No. 39, which would increase the penalty, under the clause, for a person who engages in licensable conduct without a licence. It is necessary—or desirable at any rate—to explain the background to, and purpose of, the amendment. As the Minister is aware, the maximum penalty under the clause for the offence of licensable conduct without a licence is six months' imprisonment and a £5,000 fine on summary conviction. However, there is what might be argued to be an inconsistency or disparity between that provision, on the one hand, and other provisions in relation to fines and other penalties, on the other.

This is not entirely uncharted territory. As the Minister knows, similar issues were intelligently explored during the Standing Committee on the Vehicles (Crime) Bill in January of this year. On those occasions, the Minister offered us some reassurance, and I hope that he might be able to do so in this case.

I mentioned the maximum penalty of six months' imprisonment and a £5,000 fine and emphasised that it is out of kilter with other provisions. That has caused my brow to furrow and beads of sweat to descend on it and me to agitate for the Minister adequately to explain the apparent inconsistency.