To ask His Majesty’s Government what assessment they have made of the effect on recruitment and retention of Coastguard Rescue Officers of the decision of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency to cease on-call payments.

My Lords, in the light of a Westminster Hall debate last week, representations from coastguard rescue officers and unions, and other information, the Maritime Minister in the other place has been clear on the need to listen and to reflect on the way forward, which he is doing. That is why further scheduled engagement by the Maritime and Coastguard Agency this week has been paused.

My Lords, I am grateful to my noble kinsman for that Answer.

Noble Lords:

Oh!

I have waited a long time to use that expression, and it is a pleasure to do so. The judgment of the Court of Appeal on 14 January was entirely predictable: that coastguards are what lawyers call limb (b) workers. However, the decision of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency, in response to that, was not predictable. It has degraded that status to nothing at all and removed the protections that Parliament bestowed on limb (b) workers for our heroic coastguards. Those coastguards are no longer entitled to the national minimum wage for the hours they work—indeed, to any payment at all. They are not entitled to paid holiday, to apply for protection from unlawful deductions from wages, to the protection of whistleblowing or to seek recognition for collective bargaining. Following the Court of Appeal case, which turned on this issue, they are not entitled to a trade union representative in a disciplinary hearing. Can my noble kinsman say whether he will use all the weight he can bring to bear to lean on the Maritime and Coastguard Agency to get it to reverse this awful decision?

I am not sure that I am as grateful to my noble kinsman as he is to me—but, as usual, I will answer his questions. This change has not taken place yet; it is due to take place in September. There is time for my colleague, the Maritime Minister in the other place, to listen and reflect. I have talked to him three times today and I will talk to him again after this Question. He will reflect deeply on what he has heard and what needs to be done.

My Lords, the staff survey on which the Maritime and Coastguard Agency has relied in making its case has been reported in the press as having been misrepresented by the agency to Ministers and, consequently, by Ministers to Parliament. In that light, do the Government still have confidence in the chief executive of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency? Do they continue to rely on that staff survey?

I have two things to say. First, in the course of the Maritime Minister reflecting on what he has heard, he will reflect on the accuracy and veracity of the information he has been given. Therefore, it is far too early to say what the consequence of that might be. Secondly, he has asked his officials to tell him the data that can be legitimately released so that Members of Parliament in the other place and Peers in this Chamber can hold the Government to account.

My Lords, does the Minister agree that making it so much harder for working people on low incomes to serve as coastguard rescue officers may jeopardise this life-saving service? Therefore, in this period of reflection that he has described, will he ensure that assessment is made of the impact on the diversity of workforce in this context?

I will say two things. First, the Government recognise and are fully grateful for the extraordinary service of brave and selfless volunteer coastguards. Secondly, the noble Baroness is absolutely right that, in the course of this contemplation, we need to reflect on the diversity of those volunteers. Decisions should not be made that adversely affect that.

Can the Minister say what discussions might have taken place with other government departments to compare the approach that could be taken to the coastguard with the retained firefighter model? There is a risk that, from September, both will provide on-call emergency services, often at great personal risk, but one will be recognised as a worker and remunerated while the other will not be.

I am grateful for that question. I am not currently aware of those discussions, but clearly there are similarities between some of the things that we ask selfless people in our society to do. I am sure that the Maritime Minister and the department will reflect on that with other appropriate government departments.

My Lords, the cuts proposed by the MCA have been resisted by the GMB union, as well as by coastguard rescue officers themselves. Is the Minister certain, at a time when we see more people around the coast of Britain using the sea for leisure, that the potential reduction in staff that could come from this will not put people at risk?

The course of action that needs to be taken needs to recognise that the volunteer coastguards have attended over 14,000 incidents each year for the past three years and rescued over 4,000 people annually. The Government have no intention of putting any of those people in danger. That is why my colleague in the other place is thinking so carefully about what to do next.

My Lords, it was a delightful surprise to find that there are two Lords Hendy in this House. Who knew? We are very familiar with the Minister’s skills. He will be aware that more than half of our coastguard rescue officers will leave this vital service if the Government continue on their present course. The Minister mentioned the magic word “September”. I ask him to reconsider that. We are now entering the peak risk period on our coasts, when our coastal waters are full of swimmers and sailors, and when the work of the coastguard rescue service is in peak demand. Do the Government plan to overturn the court decision on which all this stands? Given the risk, how soon should they do so? September is too late. The risk is now.

There are at least two of us in here who knew that there were two Hendys in the House. Maybe that is common knowledge now.

The noble Baroness is right: September is not far away. I put in the present tense the fact that the Maritime Minister is considering this because it needs to be considered right now and for the reasons that the noble Baroness said. Whatever course of action he decides to take needs to be taken very quickly to avoid the service being in anyway affected and to ensure the safety of people on the coast and in the sea.

My Lords, does my noble friend the Minister agree that the Maritime and Coastguard Agency’s total budget last year was £450 million, of which coastguard volunteer allowances cost under £6 million—around 1%—for which we, as a public, get a 24/7, 365-day emergency response network covering 11,000 miles of our coastline by 3,500 volunteers, who get a call-out allowance of £11 an hour, which is a tiny fraction of the 1,200 paid staff in the agency? This is a petty, punitive and pernicious cut, which I urge Ministers to reverse.

My noble friend is entirely right about all the statistics he quoted. That is why I said that the Maritime Minister is currently considering what needs to be done as a result of what he has heard, what I have heard in this House this afternoon and the other information available in order to make the right judgment about how to proceed.

My Lords, I am grateful for the Minister’s opening Answer, when he noted that the Maritime Minister was reflecting. This sounds like a case where it would be better to embrace the court decision, recognise the worker status and take the steps necessary to properly reward people who do incredibly valuable work. As the noble Lord, Lord Hain, said, it is very good value for the taxpayer. The MCA is an executive agency of the department; the Minister should take the right decision and direct the agency to carry out its instructions. That is what we expect Ministers to do, and I am sure that the Minister will impress that course upon his Commons colleague.

I do not need to do that, because the course of action that he will take, after having listened and reflected, may well be the course of action that the noble Lord suggested.