Part of Post Office (Horizon System) Offences Bill - Report and Third Reading – in the House of Lords at 5:51 pm on 23 May 2024.
Lord McNicol of West Kilbride
Shadow Spokesperson (Business and Trade), Shadow Spokesperson (Scotland)
5:51,
23 May 2024
My Lords, this Bill has always been about justice and getting it quickly for the victims of the Post Office/Fujitsu scandal. We can all agree—and have all agreed—that they have waited far too long.
I am glad that, in wash-up today, we are pushing this Bill through before the end of this Parliament, so that the individuals affected by it will receive the responses that they deserve from across Parliament as a whole—the Government, Opposition and other Benches. I am conscious that there are other important Bills that need to be debated today and tomorrow, so I will keep my comments brief. I know that there is a consensus across the House to see the overwhelming bulk, if not all, of the convictions overturned as soon as possible.
I have already spoken at length about my support for this Bill and what it does for those hundreds of innocent postmasters and postmistresses who went through our legal system and were not believed. They either pleaded guilty—the Majority, 90% I think, pleaded guilty—to get lesser terms, and the other 10% were convicted and jailed. Some have now passed or have committed suicide; we need to and should remember them. This Bill exonerates and deals with them.
Likewise, I do not need to remind the House that Labour, in voting for this Bill, in no way wants to set any kind of legal precedent where the legislature overturns decisions of the judiciary, even when those decisions were wrong. These cases are unique and we need to deal with them. On these Benches, we have sympathy with the desire of the noble Lord, Lord Arbuthnot, to see those convicted by the Court of Appeal dealt with. It is a shame that, after everything that he has done, the noble Lord is unfortunately not in his place for Report.
I know that the noble Lord, Lord Sandhurst, and others came up with proposals or ideas at Second Reading for how we could work with, help and support the individuals who went through the Court of Appeal, going back and looking again and speeding up the process to support them. I hope that the Minister, in winding up on Report, will be able to say a few words about how government can support and help. We should look to facilitate that.
While we have been discussing how we can do our best to support the victims and right the wrongs, Paula Vennells has been giving evidence to the inquiry. She has admitted misleading MPs and said that she was “unaware” of the extent of the Post Office’s prosecution functions for years. In the first hour of her evidence this morning, I counted that she said “I do not recall” 11 times and “I cannot remember” on at least six occasions. Because of the events of the past 24 hours, the spotlight has obviously moved from the inquiry and the coverage that it was rightly getting, on to the General Election. I am sure that, across this House, whatever the result of the general election, that spotlight will shift back to the decisions that the senior management team, the Post Office board and other individuals involved made and, importantly, back to the role that Fujitsu played in what happened in this terrible case.
We will not be able to revisit digital evidence today, nor what we can do with the Post Office board, nor how we deal with Fujitsu and Horizon. That will be for another day. At this stage, I look forward to the words of the Minister.
On the Amendment from the noble Lord, Lord Sikka, there is a concern around the DWP’s understanding of, and how much information it has on, those individual cases, as they are not part of this legislation. Looking at what happened in those cases will be very important.
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Many hundreds of amendments are proposed by members to major bills as they pass through committee stage, report stage and third reading in both Houses of Parliament.
In the end only a handful of amendments will be incorporated into any bill.
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As a bill passes through Parliament, MPs and peers may suggest amendments - or changes - which they believe will improve the quality of the legislation.
Many hundreds of amendments are proposed by members to major bills as they pass through committee stage, report stage and third reading in both Houses of Parliament.
In the end only a handful of amendments will be incorporated into any bill.
The Speaker - or the chairman in the case of standing committees - has the power to select which amendments should be debated.
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