Amendment 15

Domestic Abuse Bill - Report (1st Day) – in the House of Lords at 10:45 pm on 8 March 2021.

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Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top:

Moved by Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top

15: After Clause 16, insert the following new Clause—“Duties of public authorities in relation to training (1) Subject to subsection (3), all public authorities specified in section 15(3) must report to the Commissioner such statistics on enquiries or training as the Commissioner deems necessary.(2) If the Commissioner has published guidance on training or reporting under section 7(2)(d), the training or reporting provided by public authorities to their staff must meet standards specified in such guidance, so far as such standards apply to the public authority.(3) The Commissioner must produce an annual report, in accordance with section 14(2)(b).”

Photo of Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top Chair, Public Services Committee, Chair, Public Services Committee

My Lords, it is my pleasure to move this amendment which relates to the training of all front-line workers. We took away the comments and ideas from the Minister in Committee and have brought back a much more modest amendment. It removes the public duty but does lay out a process whereby the commissioner is involved in assessing the training, according to the guidance the Government have published and will, I hope, improve. It also establishes that the commissioner should produce a report each year.

I want to talk about two things, the first of which is guidance being the main instrument to ensure training. The Government are going to have to look at this to make sure that the guidance actually does what it is meant to do. We know from the research that I mentioned in Committee that, for example, despite NICE guidance, there is considerable inconsistency across mental health trusts as to whether they ask such questions at all and have a policy of engaging with patients about any history of violence they may have. The main thing is that past guidance has not secured what I believe the Government or Parliament have expected in terms of a response to training, simply because the guidance is there.

Secondly, I know the commissioner is keen on this issue and I want to thank the Minister for engaging with it—we had a very useful meeting last week. In her letter to me, she said that relevant public authorities are dealt with through Clause 4, which already places a duty on the commissioner to publish an annual report. The Minister says in the letter, which is in the Library, that it is open to the commissioner to address matters relating to training and reporting in such annual reports. I am really pleased about that, but it has been pointed out to me that she can only do this in the way we know is necessary if she has sufficient resources. That is an issue for the Government. I hope the Minister can reassure us that there will be specific resources to make inquiries about training, in order to ensure that the commissioner knows where there is good practice and how it is being enacted, and that she is able to talk in her annual report about what is working well and how that needs to be developed across the piece.

As the Minister reminds me in the letter, public authorities are required to have regard to any guidance issued under Clause 73. I am simply saying to her that they have had that obligation in the past and not fulfilled it. If the commissioner is going to have the responsibility to say whether she thinks they are fulfilling these responsibilities, she is going to need the resources.

I hope that the commissioner will be able to identify good practice, including front-line workers from different services coming together, but also training that involves people with lived experience. For example, experts with lived experience have worked with DWP managers in Newcastle on recognising people with trauma who may, and often do, present at the local office. They work with them on how to ask the right questions and how to ensure they get the most appropriate interventions. These experts by experience are also training health workers, which has proved extremely successful.

There are very good examples around the different public services of things that have worked well, but it is incredibly patchy and thin and simply not adequate to reassure women that they will get the response they need when they turn up clearly troubled and silent, because they cannot talk about anything. They need the appropriate response, as we have said in discussing earlier amendments.

I am disappointed that the Government did not simply accept these amendments, because this theme would have made many of the other issues we are discussing much easier to deal with. However, I am grateful to the Minister and to Agenda for the work that has been put in on this issue. I look forward to the debate, and I beg to move.

Photo of Baroness Helic Baroness Helic Conservative 11:00, 8 March 2021

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Marks, for signing Amendment 44 and for his assistance in drafting it. It is an evolution of the one that I tabled in Committee, which received strong support from your Lordships’ House. It seeks to ensure that high-level training on domestic abuse, developed with experts, is mandatory for all judges and magistrates hearing family cases. I am grateful to my noble friend Lord Wolfson for meeting with me this morning, and for his acknowledgement that training is a crucial piece of the puzzle in tackling harm and improving family courts. This amendment will be a major contribution to improving the provision and quality of training. That will make our family courts work better and provide the protection, support and justice that victims and their children deserve.

It is a sorry fact that the courts are failing victims. Process and procedure can feel stacked against them. In the worst cases, the courts themselves can be subverted by abusers so that they serve not as a source of justice but as a tool of abuse. For example, one survivor has been taken to the family court by her abuser 27 times since 2015. The court has become the new venue for control.

To give another example, a woman who had been advised to leave her abusive partner by the police, a GP and the independent domestic violence adviser saw her case rushed through and extensive evidence of abuse overlooked by a judge who showed little evidence of awareness of domestic abuse. The words of that survivor should be in all our minds as we consider this Bill:

“We fled to be free from domestic abuse, yet now my ex-husband is allowed to continue his abuse legally through the family court.”

That is a terrible situation. Unfortunately, it is a common one that the Government are all too well aware of, given the harrowing evidence collected during their own harm panel review.

Many provisions in the Bill seek to address this problem. I particularly welcome the excellent progress on post-separation abuse, barring orders and the banning of cross-examination, but we need training to give those provisions practical, tangible value to ensure that they work on the ground to protect survivors and their children. It was a main recommendation of the harm panel, and it is critical to changing cultures and practices within the courts. Without those changes, these new measures will not be enough. They will provide false promises of hope to survivors, and new mechanisms are no help if domestic abuse continues to be overlooked, misunderstood and dismissed.

I know that my noble friend the Minister recognises the importance of training. The Government’s commitment to trialling improved guidance and training across the system is a welcome first step, but it is crucial that this amendment be accepted. Without the statutory imperative and government oversight, we are not providing survivors with any guarantee that work is under way to change the systemic cultural issues that have been identified.

By placing a statutory duty on the Lord Chancellor to publish a strategy and timetable for judicial training, we can ensure scrutiny, rigour and effectiveness, and we can guarantee that this is a commitment that outlasts individual Ministers and funding cycles. By specifying some of the material that the training must cover, we can ensure that it gives judges and magistrates a thorough grounding in all the different ways that domestic abuse can influence a court case or should be taken into account when considering child welfare. By involving the domestic abuse commissioner, we can ensure high-quality training, informed by up-to-date expert thinking that equips our judges and magistrates with the skill they need to wrestle with these difficult cases to provide protection and justice to survivors of abuse.

This amendment will strengthen the training provided; crucially, it will also make it mandatory. Over the course of this Bill, one of the things that we have heard is how insidious domestic abuse can be, how it can appear across all aspects of the family courts’ work and how it can be used to subvert them. This is why it is so important that any judge hearing a family case has a good knowledge of domestic abuse and how it can influence a case.

Domestic abuse must be taken into consideration in the course of a trial, when considering appropriate ways to proceed and when reaching a judgment. It is impossible to do that well without regular training that is consistent, comprehensive and created by true experts. If we do not embed these parameters in legislation, I am afraid that we will be here in a decade’s time, discussing the same ongoing issues in the courts. I dread to think how many people will have suffered during this time if we fail to act properly now.

Family cases are perhaps some of the most difficult and complex cases anywhere in our courts. In the great majority, judges act with wisdom, compassion and care. This amendment should not be seen as an attack on them; rather, it is about ensuring that they have the tools and skills that they need to do their job. Just as we expect judges to be versed in the law, so they should be versed in the facts and consequences of domestic abuse. We owe that to victims going through the courts and to the judges and magistrates themselves.

We have listened to the concerns raised by some noble Lords in Committee and adapted the amendment accordingly. It now guarantees a role in designing training for the Judicial College, the President of the Family Division and the chief executive of the Magistrates’ Association. They will play an important role in making sure that training is as effective as it can be. I hope that this more collaborative approach will attract even wider support than the original amendment.

This amendment is only a start; we should be thinking about training for all staff in the courts and all others, such as Cafcass employees and social workers. However, it is a crucial start: it is how we make the excellent provisions in the Bill a reality on the ground. It is how we will be able to tell survivors in full truth that we have taken real steps to protect them. I hope that my noble friend the Minister will think again and accept this amendment. However, I am prepared to test the opinion of the House.

Photo of Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames Liberal Democrat Lords Spokesperson (Justice)

My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Helic, for putting down and so persuasively opening this debate on Amendment 44, to which I will speak and have added my name. In Committee, we discussed judicial training at some length. It was interesting that there was general agreement that the amendment on judicial training was by far the most important of all the amendments in a raft of suggested measures seeking reform to procedure in the family courts.

I agree with the noble and learned Baroness, Lady Butler-Sloss, that the Judicial College provides first-class training for judges and magistrates, with its induction courses for those newly appointed or newly authorised to hear family cases and through continuing education, practical workshops and training materials, appraisal and mentoring. Nothing I say should be taken as a criticism of the quality of the work done by that college. However, one thread that ran through the debate in Committee was that, time and again, victims of domestic violence found their experiences of bringing cases in family courts to be somewhere between daunting and terrifying, They often found the courts and judges profoundly out of sympathy with the suffering of abuse victims.

We have improved training for judges and magistrates in recent years but there is no room for complacency. Victims’ experiences have not reflected that improvement. So bad is it that, for many, the lack of sympathy which they learn from others to expect from courts puts them off bringing cases at all. Others go to court once and come out saying “never again”.

Part of the problem stems from the divergence, long recognised, between judges’ life experiences and those of victims and parties who come before them. In Committee, I said that

“we must recognise that most judges and legal professionals come from a world that differs dramatically from the world that is home to many … litigants who come before them: victims, abusers, witnesses and others.”—[Official Report, 3/2/21; col. 2240.]

Of course, that is a generalisation. In spite of the obvious handicap of a continuing and depressing lack of racial, social and gender diversity among the judiciary at all levels, many judges have the capacity, empathy, wisdom, experience and training to understand the suffering that they try to relieve with the decisions that they make, but many do not, hence the disappointment and concern.

Much of this comes as no surprise to government. The MoJ’s report on assessing harm was published as recently as June 2020. Unsurprisingly, it found substantial crossover between children’s and domestic abuse cases. I cite only a few of its findings; they chime with what we have heard from the many briefings that we have received from victims’ groups, the London Victims’ Commissioner, Women’s Aid and many others. The report said:

“Submissions highlighted a feeling that abuse is systematically minimised, ranging from children’s voices not being heard, allegations being ignored, dismissed or disbelieved, to inadequate assessment of risk, traumatic court processes, perceived unsafe child arrangements, and abusers exercising continued control through repeat litigation and the threat of repeat litigation.”

A little later, it said:

“There are particular barriers for victims of BAME backgrounds in raising domestic abuse; victims and the professionals supporting them perceived these barriers as involving racism, in addition to sexism and class prejudice. Male victims also face particular barriers, with some respondents highlighting that stereotypes about ‘real’ victims present an obstacle to being believed.”

We have made much progress in this Bill, with provisions now proposed and more accepted for special measures for witnesses and parties, and to prohibit direct cross-examination. But there is far more to be done and we should not leave it to the Judicial College exclusively. The role of the college is hugely important and, as the noble Baroness, Lady Helic, pointed out, it has a major role in our amendment. Were it to be underpinned by a statutory duty, we might make quicker progress in improving victims’ confidence in the family courts.

That is why we need a strategy and timetable for specialist training for family court judges and magistrates in cases involving rape, sexual and domestic abuse, and coercive control. We need to ensure continuing professional development, because the learning and understanding of these issues is always moving forward. Training must cover the impact of trauma, the risks and difficulties of giving evidence and of taking part in proceedings. Developing the strategy and timetable should involve the Judicial College, but also the President of the Family Division, the Magistrates’ Association and the domestic abuse commissioner. We should be working towards a requirement that every judge or magistrate sitting in a family court must have completed the mandatory training.

For my part, I have reconsidered my hesitation about imposing a statutory duty on the Secretary of State, and I do not share the opposition of the noble and learned Baroness, Lady Butler-Sloss—with whom I very rarely disagree—to so doing. We need a strategy and timetable for delivering this training, with a focus on trauma and on making courts into sympathetic and positive environments for victims, a strong commitment to continuing development and a requirement that no one sits on family cases without such training. Those commitments should be on the face of this landmark Bill. We cannot continue letting victims down by a combination of underpreparing our judiciary and complacently relying on a belief in complete judicial expertise, which is, sadly, often misplaced.

Photo of Baroness Newlove Baroness Newlove Deputy Chairman of Committees, Deputy Speaker (Lords) 11:15, 8 March 2021

My Lords, I speak in support of Amendment 44. This vital amendment was put forward by my noble friend Lady Helic—who was brilliant at speaking and introducing this amendment—along with the noble Lord, Lord Marks. Listening just now, I am in admiration of his speech.

As has been discussed, this amendment will introduce mandatory training on domestic abuse for judges and magistrates hearing family cases. I thank my noble friend Lady Helic for her work on this amendment and her commitment to improving the safety of family courts for survivors of domestic abuse.

The case for this amendment is very clear, as we have just heard from the noble Lord, Lord Marks, and my noble friend Lady Helic. The Government’s own harm panel report collected overwhelming evidence on the systemic failings of our family courts to properly account for and guard against domestic abuse. Government Ministers have stated that they support the aims of this amendment and the principles which sit behind it, so I am left wondering why they will not take this clear and decisive step to improve and modernise the culture in the family courts and place this on the face of the Bill.

Instead of repeating points that have been so eloquently made by others during the passage of the Bill, I want to use my time to share the story of a survivor I met a few months ago. I hope her experience will again serve as a reminder of why we are here and who we are fighting for.

This victim took the courage to leave a violent, abusive relationship shortly after her baby was born a number of years ago. However, she remained controlled, harassed, stalked and humiliated by her abuser, who has been enabled by the family courts. Despite an extensive non-molestation order being in place, this victim has been through four years of family court proceedings and has been to court 17 times, including during the Covid lockdown periods. The abuser in this case has significant financial resources and so has spent hundreds of thousands of pounds on his legal team, who rushed her to court multiple times knowing full well that she had no funds to access legal representation and no legal aid.

The court enabled further abuse by allowing him ongoing control and granting supervised contact. Risks to her safety should have been identified as the non-molestation order had been granted on the basis of his violence towards her. Nevertheless, the victim was ordered by the court that she could not take her phone with her during the supervised contact time. She was told that if he hit her or was otherwise violent towards her, she could wait until after the visitation was over to call the police.

The court has reputedly ignored evidence of the abuse against her and her son, who is now living with his violent father. She has lost all contact with her child because a judge declared that her decision to have another baby in a new relationship was a form of parental alienation.

The amendment we are now debating could have helped this survivor and many others I have heard about in a number of ways over a number of years. Mandatory training would have equipped our judges with the knowledge to understand the implications of a non-molestation order and the ongoing risks posed by a violent abuser. It would have supported judges to identify the pattern of aggressive litigation as another manifestation of the abuser’s controlling behaviour, and it would have helped judges to come to safer decisions around child contact arrangements or even to revoke the presumption of parental involvement in the context of a previously violent relationship.

The case I have outlined is particularly shocking because the abuse was easily evidenced and had been confirmed in other areas of the justice system, yet the family courts still failed to protect this survivor and her child. But as we know, other forms of abuse are less overt, more insidious and can be less clearly quantified. What hope do the courts have of identifying abuse when they are not being used legitimately but as a tool to continue control and abuse? Regular mandatory training by experts is required.

I am afraid that we too must consider our responsibilities in cases like this one. As a society and as a Government, we urge survivors to find the courage to leave abuse. We have promoted campaigns which tell survivors, “You are not alone.” But once they do leave, we abandon them at the gates of the family courts where we know that their safety and the safety of their children cannot be guaranteed and the risk of abuse is likely to be overlooked.

For too long, too many of us have turned a blind eye to what is happening in our family courts. We have gathered the evidence and have heard countless stories, so we can no longer claim not to know what is going on. The family courts are failing the survivors of domestic abuse and this landmark legislation will not live up to such a title if it leaves a gaping hole in protection and support by not introducing mandatory training on domestic abuse in family courts. Basically, it is not worth the paper it is written on.

As someone with a background of working in our courts, when I became the other side, the safety net is not as strong and supportive for victims and their families. I therefore urge my noble friend the Minister and the Government to take the necessary action and support this amendment.

Photo of Lord Hunt of Kings Heath Lord Hunt of Kings Heath Labour

My Lords, although I will speak to Amendment 15, I should say this on Amendment 44: who could not be moved by the remarks of the noble Baroness, Lady Newlove? In many ways the issues that she, the noble Baroness, Lady Helic, and the noble Lord, Lord Marks, have developed are consistent with those raised by my noble friend Lady Armstrong.

At Second Reading, my noble friend described the challenge of supporting women who are at risk of losing custody of their children, where the main need was identified as domestic abuse. Supporting women who are facing multiple disadvantages requires a workforce with the skills, knowledge, and awareness to understand the range of experiences women have faced. It requires funders, commissioners and policymakers to value the workforce and be prepared to support the development of their expertise. This is particularly so for those who have lived experience—an important point made by my noble friend. Unfortunately, that is not always forthcoming. Many practitioners have reported that the ongoing training and awareness raising needed to support this type of practice was often the first thing to be cut to save money. There are other challenges in the wider workforce; evidence shows that public services are failing to pick up domestic abuse and respond appropriately. This means that many survivors are passed from service to service before finally getting the support they need, causing years of preventable hurt and even putting lives at risk. The need for effective investment in training and support for staff is overwhelming.

In Committee, the Minister said she was in full agreement with our aims of wanting professionals to have the skills and confidence to ask the right questions about domestic abuse and take the appropriate action. She said she wanted to ensure that there is strong recognition, from senior leadership through to front-line staff, of the importance of tackling domestic abuse. She said she wanted staff to ask about domestic abuse, because it is integral to their role and driven by professional curiosity. Unfortunately, she also warned against introducing a statutory duty, in that she thought it risked undermining professional judgment. I disagree. Although she referred to a number of good practice examples, and to the current provisions, the problem is that these are very patchy. Training is not sufficiently available, and where it is available, it is not often given in the most effective way possible. It is not good enough to simply encourage it to be done better in the future—there must be some statutory bite.

My noble friend has modified her Committee stage amendments and is focusing on the commissioner having the ability to publish guidance and an annual report. The Minister has today acknowledged that this is something the commissioner can do outwith statutory provision. But there is no doubt that statute gives power to the commissioner in her ability to make things happen. The commissioner also needs resources, which she may not have, to take on this new role.

I hope that the Minister will take this back to her department. Of all the measures we require to make this Bill a success, the training and support of staff seems to be one of the most important, and I believe that both these amendments—different from each other, but dealing with parallel issues—deserve considerable support.

Photo of Baroness Uddin Baroness Uddin Non-affiliated 11:30, 8 March 2021

My Lords, it is a great pleasure to follow my noble friend Lord Hunt of Kings Heath, and the very inspirational speech of the noble Baroness, Lady Newlove. I am in awe of her championing of these matters.

As a professional social worker for some years—although I am long in the tooth now—I cannot imagine dealing with child protection of any nature without having the confidence of knowing that I am well trained. I therefore welcome Amendment 15, and will also make some comments about Amendment 44. I am deeply indebted to my noble friend Lady Armstrong for her thoughtful contributions from Second Reading onward. Having heard the profoundly persuasive and detailed arguments of the noble Baroness, Lady Helic, and the noble Lord, Lord Marks, I speak in support of mandatory judicial training. I believe it to be essential to treat survivors’ experience with the required level of due care.

My noble friend Lady Armstrong highlighted the impact of a well-trained workforce, including police and children’s services, as well as the potential positive effect of well-trained jobcentre managers. We cannot hope to change societal attitudes to poor institutional practices unless government is committed to adequately funding and mandating training at all levels of service, including the highest level in the judiciary. If the noble Baroness, Lady Helic, moves her amendment I will definitely support her.

The amendment also asks that front-line public service staff are properly trained and competent and fully equipped to ensure that thorough assessments can be made of survivors’ needs. Although it is correct that individual public services may be best placed to understand the most effective ways to develop training for their staff, as is argued by the Government, it cannot be overstated that our public institutions may not be the first port of call for help for many women of minority heritage. Therefore, specialist organisations would also require support and training to effectively realise those ambitions. I was so moved by the way that the noble Lord, Lord Marks, argued on behalf of the needs of diverse communities that I need not say another word.

Does the Minister agree that we also need to influence our educational curriculum and provide age-appropriate information? We already do this with regard to sexual orientation and Prevent et cetera; we make sure that our children have information on a whole range of issues. Unless and until we take the matter of violence in the home seriously—violence experienced by parents, relatives or whoever—and we give some details of acknowledgement and equip children, they may not know where to go when they witness this.

I do not have the statistics to hand but is the Minister aware of the evidence which indicates that significant numbers of teenage children, as young as 11, 12 and 13, are accepting violence as a norm within their relationships? This is as well as the tragedy of sexual exploitation and abuse of children which continues to grow exponentially and has overwhelmed the NSPCC, Barnardo’s and other leading children’s organisations.

Training resulting in greater awareness may not be the panacea for stopping violence and preventing the murder of women and children in the immediate future, but combined with the force of law and a well-trained front-line workforce, including the judiciary, the financial support and measures proposed in the Bill will certainly go a long way to build in additional safeguards and improve the chances of survivors to survive violence and abuse.

Photo of Baroness Bertin Baroness Bertin Conservative

My Lords, I will speak briefly to Amendment 44. I thank my noble friend Lady Helic and Claire Waxman, the Victims’ Commissioner for London, and her team for bringing the issue of training to the forefront of this legislation. The evidence provided by my noble friend Lady Helic and others was harrowing, but hearing it is essential. As they said, too often it seems that our family courts are not the tools of justice they ought to be; instead, they can be used to continue that abuse.

Too often we fail to equip judges and magistrates with the knowledge they need to spot and prevent this reality. In doing so, we are denying many victims justice. We in this House can legislate all we like but if those on the front line are not adequately trained, as we have heard, it risks remaining just words, and, as my noble friend Lady Newlove said, not worth the paper they are written on. I believe we can and must do better than this. We should strive to ensure that our courts are at the cutting edge, and not repeatedly behind the curve.

The Bill introduces a number of excellent progressive measures that have the potential to help the family courts to deliver justice safely. They include recognising post-separation abuse and extending the grounds on which barring orders can be used. For those the Government certainly deserve credit, but the success of such measures and the guarantee that they will be translated into better practice on the ground hinges on this training amendment.

The amendment renders the need for training into clear language, creating an imperative to act. We need accountability and oversight in this area, as many others have said. If the Government resist putting the amendment into the Bill—and I do not really understand why they should—then at least we need to get to a place where the judiciary are being open and transparent about the level and quantity of training that they are receiving. Who is giving the training? Is it quality assured and rigorous enough? These are questions that need to be properly addressed.

We have heard a lot in previous debates about the need for data collection. In many areas across business and public life, it is transparency and good reporting that often create best practice, and it does not seem unreasonable for the public but also for the Government to be privy to such data. That would drive change from the bottom up.

We also need to be sure that training reflects the new provisions in the Bill immediately rather than them filtering into the system over a period of months or, worse still, years. Of course it cannot simply be a tick-box exercise that does not drill into the complexity of the reality on the ground with some of these cases. Post-separation coercive control, for example, is a multifaceted and insidious crime committed by devious and practised individuals. They need to meet their match in the courtroom, from magistrates upwards.

As my noble friend Lady Helic has rightly said, this is not an attack on the wisdom of our lawgivers. It is the opposite: providing them with training would deepen that wisdom and arm them with the means to deal with these complex cases. Doing so would give victims faith and confidence in our justice system and let them know that our courts were with them, not against them. It would also send a strong message to perpetrators that the courts were tools of justice, not another weapon to use against their victim.

I know that my noble friend the Minister is sensitive to these issues, and I am sure her answer will reflect that. As I have said before, I do not understand the resistance to putting this into the Bill, but I will listen carefully to her response. I hope she will come forward with some answers that move towards real progress and an understanding of what needs to be done.

Photo of Baroness Crawley Baroness Crawley Labour

My Lords, I will be brief. It is a pleasure to follow the noble Baroness, Lady Bertin, on the important Amendment 44. I wish to speak in particular to Amendment 15 in this group, which would transform and regularise the very disparate current systems by which front-line staff of public authorities inquire into domestic violence and take action.

Since Committee, when we last debated this amendment, my noble friend Lady Armstrong has removed the statutory duty wording in order to see this important provision in the Bill. She and I have also had a helpful meeting with the Minister, whom we thank for her time. The new amendment makes clear that there should still be a transparency mechanism to hold public services to account. It is important to note that the domestic abuse commissioner remains supportive of this new adapted amendment and that, as my noble friends Lady Armstrong and Lord Hunt have said, adequate resources are needed to monitor and annually report on statistics on training in such inquiries.

In Committee, the Minister said she did not want sensitive and complex conversations turned into some sort of tick-box exercise. That is understandable, but our response is that the amendment would actually give public services and staff the space and independence to use their professional judgment as long as the context was transparent for monitoring purposes.

In her letter to my noble friend Lady Armstrong following our meeting, the noble Baroness, Lady Williams, makes the helpful observation that relevant public authorities, as listed in Clause 15, are subject to the duty to co-operate with the commissioner, and that this would include the provision of statistics and other information specified in subsection (1) of the new clause, as my noble friend said. She also makes it clear that it is open to the commissioner to address matters relating to training and reporting in her duty to produce an annual report. But, while I hear and to some extent understand the Government’s reluctance to give specific direction in primary legislation to the domestic abuse commissioner regarding the need for public authorities to undertake front-line training, the present situation, based as it is on guidance, cannot continue to let down victims as it does. I look forward to the Minister’s response, in which I hope we will hear clearly her agreement with the principle of the amendment and how it can be taken forward.

Photo of Baroness Butler-Sloss Baroness Butler-Sloss Chair, Ecclesiastical Committee (Joint Committee), Chair, Ecclesiastical Committee (Joint Committee) 11:45, 8 March 2021

My Lords, I think I must be the only person who is opposing Amendment 44. I was president of the Family Division and was previously chairman of the family committee of the predecessor of the Judicial College. I do not accept all the criticisms of the noble Baroness, Lady Helic, and other noble Lords, but I realise that I have not sat as a judge for many years. I was sad to hear the criticisms of the noble Lord, Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames, and what he has said needs to be raised with the president and the chairman of the Judicial College. I of course agree that we will need training in the new Act, but we also need consideration of how some judges have behaved. I have listened with increasing concern to what has been said about the way some people have been treated in the courts; I find that very sad to hear.

I have already said something briefly about the Judicial College on an earlier amendment and shall try not to repeat it, but it is important that it is recognised by the House that the college provides continuing specialist training. Sadly, we all know that domestic abuse has been a serious issue for many years. When I was a family judge, I tried far too many such cases. All family judges and magistrates in the family courts have mandatory, comprehensive, residential training on family issues, which of course includes domestic abuse, which is a core function of judicial family training and is taken extremely seriously. Rape, sexual abuse and domestic abuse are all part of the training. Judges without family training cannot try these cases. The judges and magistrates hear directly from victims, as well as from medical and social work experts. The training is rigorous and the trainers are themselves trained. The college is transparent in what it teaches, and what it trains can be seen.

I can assure noble Lords that the Domestic Abuse Act will be taught to judges and family magistrates and will become a focal point of judicial training. I am sure that judges and family magistrates will be given immediate training of some sort as soon as it becomes law, and the Act will become part of all residential courses. As we have been hearing this evening, judges and magistrates are not perfect and make mistakes from time to time. The Court of Appeal, where I sat for about 10 years, hears a lot of family appeals and does its best to put right what in the first instance has gone wrong.

The Bill is crucial, as we all know, and it is understandable and commendable that noble Lords want judges and magistrates to have the best possible training to implement it, but I really cannot believe it is necessary to have this in primary legislation. The president, the chairman, the director and members of the college who teach judges and magistrates know that the Domestic Abuse Act must be taught as a matter of great importance. I am sure the director of the Judicial College ought to be discussing the Act with the commissioner, and it would be helpful if that took place.

The criticisms from the noble Lord, Lord Marks, and other noble Lords need to be considered as a matter of urgency by the Judicial College, but I ask the sponsors of this amendment: what more would actually be done by putting into primary legislation that the Act must be taught to judges and magistrates when it will be taught without the introduction of this clause? The very serious criticisms that have been made this evening are also matters that, as I have already said, the president and chairman of the college need to take extremely seriously. I have no doubt that the President of the Family Division will keep a close eye on the content and the way in which the Act will be taught and will look very anxiously at what has already been said. As I have already said, in my view the amendment is not necessary. It unfairly calls into question the valuable work of the Judicial College and the conscientious teaching by the judges who carry out this training, together with many experts. The criticisms must be taken into account and looked at, but to put it into primary legislation will not take this matter any further.

Photo of Baroness Burt of Solihull Baroness Burt of Solihull Liberal Democrat

My Lords, I will speak to Amendment 15, in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Armstrong, to which I have added my name. My noble friend Lord Marks has already given a very full and knowledgeable explanation of Amendment 44 and its importance. Amendment 15 is a slimmed-down version of Amendment 53, tabled in Committee, which I also supported. This amendment is also less prescriptive than the original: instead of a statutory requirement to train, it now requires only reports to the commissioner on what training is being done. I have seen the letter from the Minister to the noble Baroness, Lady Armstrong, and am pleased to hear about the lengths that are being gone to in order to produce the guidance, which has already been drafted, and the comprehensive framework, to be published later this year.

However, guidance frameworks are not a magic wand. They do not make departments implement them. The commissioner needs to know how far the guidance is actually being followed. She still needs the information so that she can analyse what training is being undertaken, build a picture of best, and less good, practice, and share that publicly in her annual report—not to shame, but to show.

In Committee, we discussed extensively the variability in the prevalence and effectiveness of training across different public authorities and different geographical areas. If we learned nothing else, we learned that the problem of domestic abuse is no respecter of circumstances, class, ethnicity or geographical area. We learned that the problem is pervasive, affecting an estimated 1.6 million people in 2019, and we know that it got worse during the pandemic. In her response, the Minister declared the Government to be fully in agreement with the aims of the then amendment, but she said that a statutory duty “risks undermining professional judgment” and that she did not want

“these sensitive and complex conversations to turn into some sort of tick-box exercise.”—[GC 1738.]">Official Report, 27/1/21; col. GC 1738.]

That is absolutely fair enough, but it is not the issue here. While some have had excellent professional training, others have not and do not have the confidence to even broach that “sensitive and complex” conversation to which the Minister referred. They may not even have a tick box. In Committee, we heard from the noble Baroness, Lady Armstrong, about reports from the campaigning group Agenda stating that, although 38% of women with mental health problems had been abused, one-third of mental health trusts did not even have a policy on domestic abuse.

If you look at Clause 15(3) of this Bill, you will see how many specific public authorities are involved with domestic abuse—in my Amendment 12, I have added a few more for good measure. Amendment 15 would enable the commissioner to form a picture of what training is, or is not, happening in all public authorities which have contact with victims. She could use this intelligence to form a picture of where opportunities are being utilised and where they are being missed. She could see where training is effective—and we have heard several examples of that—and where it is not. She could issue guidelines built on knowledge of what works in different circumstances. This modest amendment could have big consequences for the chances of victims—whoever they are and whichever public service they use—to be spotted and helped. Let us give our commissioner the tools she needs to do the job.

Photo of Lord Kennedy of Southwark Lord Kennedy of Southwark Opposition Whip (Lords), Shadow Spokesperson (Home Affairs), Shadow Spokesperson (Communities and Local Government), Shadow Spokesperson (Housing)

My Lords, I am conscious of the time, so the House does not need 15 minutes from me on why we should support these amendments. I will make a few quick points to enable the Minister to respond fully to the debate.

I support both amendments. We have heard some excellent speeches this evening. I hope the Minister can give a detailed response to my noble friend Lady Armstrong. She has amended her amendment to take on board the comments made by the Minister in Committee.

I hear that the noble Baroness, Lady Helic, may divide the House on Amendment 44 when we reach it. I can offer the support of these Benches if she decides to do so. This may focus the minds of some noble Lords in this debate. I shall leave it there and look forward to the Minister’s response.

Photo of Baroness Williams of Trafford Baroness Williams of Trafford The Minister of State, Home Department

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, for the parting shot. I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Armstrong, and my noble friend Lady Helic for raising the issue of training for front-line professionals in relation to domestic abuse. Quality training is important to equip practitioners with the knowledge and skills they need to protect and support victims of domestic abuse, including children, in an appropriate manner.

We can also agree on another aspect of the amendment from the noble Baroness, Lady Armstrong. As the noble Lord, Lord Hunt articulated, professionals need to have the skills and confidence to ask the right questions about domestic abuse, and then take the right course of action. If the pandemic has taught us anything, it has served to further highlight the importance of professionals across a wide range of disciplines recognising the signs of domestic abuse and responding accordingly.

The noble Baroness, Lady Uddin, talked about relationship and sex education in schools. Healthy relationships in this area are more important than ever.

In January, we launched “Ask for ANI”, the code word scheme that is now in operation across thousands of pharmacies. The scheme provides a clear process to follow. Working closely with the sector, we have developed bespoke training and guidance to support it to deliver this additional assistance. We have ensured that victims have a means to access potentially life-changing support, and have seen more than 45 uses of the scheme already. This is excellent news.

Those working in vaccination centres are also being provided with bespoke training to ensure that they pick up any signs of domestic abuse and can respond to disclosures should they be made in such safe spaces. I am sure we can all agree that the response and approach to identifying domestic abuse in a pharmacy and in a vaccination centre is very different from how one might respond in a school or a job centre. That is why reporting protocols and training are best developed and delivered by the appropriate responsible agency in each sector. Therein lies the expertise, so we should not adopt a one-size-fits-all approach. The training needs to be tailored to the circumstances of each professional group and will, therefore, take many different forms.

While the domestic abuse commissioner and her office may support organisations in the development of their training, and may deliver some training itself—as Clause 7(2)(d) envisages—it is not appropriate, or indeed realistic, to expect the commissioner to be specifying training or reporting standards for the diverse range of public authorities specified in Clause 15.

It is true to say that the response to domestic abuse is not always as tailored as it should be. As the noble Baroness, Lady Armstrong, showcased in her commission, Breaking Down the Barriers, it can unfortunately be patchy, to use her words. Currently, national guidance can augment and complement sector-specific guidance. That is why the statutory guidance that we will issue under Clause 73 details how healthcare professionals, employers, schools, jobcentres and others should respond to domestic abuse. I have written to the noble Baroness about the guidance, and hope that it has provided some reassurance to her—I think it has, by the sound of what she said—that the response to domestic abuse by each agency is one that is tailored and as effective as it can be.

Since the draft guidance was published last July, Home Office officials have engaged extensively with the sector to refine and improve it. Front-line expertise and academics from healthcare, housing, the criminal justice system and the children’s sector have contributed with feedback. There will be a further opportunity for all interested parties to comment and make suggestions for further improvements when we conduct the formal consultation following Royal Assent.

The adequacy of domestic abuse training, both in terms of its content and its availability, will, I am sure, be something that the domestic abuse commissioner will wish to examine. Part 2 of the Bill affords her the necessary powers to do so. It is worth drawing out some of the provisions in Part 2, as I hope that I can persuade the noble Baroness that much of what Amendment 15 seeks to do is already covered by the provisions in this part.

Clause 7 affords the commissioner a wide remit in encouraging good practice in the prevention of domestic abuse and the provision of protection and support to victims. This will include good practice in relation to the reporting of domestic abuse and the provision of training. Clause 7(2) specifically refers to the monitoring of the provision of services and the provision of training, which noble Lords have referred to.

Clause 15 requires the public authorities specified in subsection (3) of that clause to co-operate with the commissioner so far as is reasonably practicable. Such co-operation will include the provision of information to the commissioner. Consequently, subsection (1) of the noble Baroness’s proposed new clause is unnecessary. The commissioner can already, under Clause 15, request the information set out there, and the relevant public authorities are under a duty to respond.

In addition, Clause 8 enables the commissioner to inquire into and report on matters relating to training, and to direct specific recommendations at one or more relevant public authorities. Under Clause 16, those same public authorities will need to respond to any such recommendations within 56 days.

Finally, Clause 14 requires the commissioner to prepare and publish an annual report. Subject to the minimum requirements set out in Clause 14(2), it is a matter for the commissioner to determine what she includes in her annual report. It is therefore open to the commissioner to report annually on the adequacy or otherwise of the training available to those working in relevant public authorities.

In short, while I commend and support the objectives behind Amendment 15, I do not believe that it takes us materially further forward, given that Part 2 already affords the commissioner the ability to collect data and to report on, and make recommendations about, the provision of training and reporting mechanisms.

Amendment 44, in the name of my noble friend Lady Helic, focuses on the important issue of training for judges and magistrates in the family courts. As I indicated in Committee, I am in agreement that, as with other professionals, members of the judiciary should be fully supported via appropriate training to properly identify and understand the impact of all types of domestic abuse, so that they can respond appropriately when making decisions in domestic abuse-related cases.

I also acknowledge, implicit in subsection (2) of my noble friend’s new clause, the fact that victims and survivors of domestic abuse can face difficulties in the family justice system, including difficulties during proceedings and when giving evidence. The harm panel brought these issues into sharp focus last year, and there are provisions in the Bill that have been informed by the expert panel’s report.

However, the Justice Secretary cannot and should not take on a responsibility to prescribe or oversee this training for judges and magistrates. The statutory duty for judicial training rightly sits with the Lord Chief Justice. For the Secretary of State to even publish a strategy or timetable on this matter would be to undermine the important constitutional principle of judicial independence. I am confident that there is no need or requirement to place a statutory duty on the Secretary of State for domestic abuse training for judicial officeholders. As I indicated in Committee, training for the judiciary is not a matter for primary legislation. The noble and learned Baroness, Lady Butler-Sloss, quite forcefully made this point.

The Judicial College welcomed the harm panel recommendations relating to the training of the judiciary and remains committed to continually reviewing and improving the training delivered to the judiciary, including magistrates. Furthermore, the president of the Family Division has indicated he will consider making recommendations regarding training to the Judicial College in light of this Bill, the recommendations of the harm panel report and any guidance produced as a result of the four recent Court of Appeal domestic abuse cases that were heard earlier this year and to which the noble and learned Baroness, Lady Butler-Sloss, referred when she spoke to this issue in Committee.

Further to this, I know that my noble friend Lord Wolfson will raise this at his monthly meeting with the president of the Family Division. I also understand that he will write ahead of the meeting. We are always willing to get data on various things, including, in this case, how many judges are getting training and how often.

More broadly, in response to the harm panel report, the Government have already committed to reducing inconsistency and entrenching best practice across the family justice system. As has already been outlined, I can assure my noble friend that the senior judiciary are engaged with the issue of training and are supportive of this aim.

Given, first, the constitutional issues and, secondly, the clear commitments on training and guidance from the Government, the Judicial College and the president of the Family Division, I hope I have been able to persuade my noble friend Lady Helic that it would not be appropriate to add Amendment 44 to the Bill.

In conclusion, I strongly support the aims of both these amendments, but, for the reasons I have set out, it would not be appropriate to include them in the Bill. As I have explained, Amendment 44 undermines the constitutional separation of powers between the Executive and the judiciary, while Amendment 15 significantly overlaps with, and therefore adds little to, the provisions already made elsewhere in Part 2 and Clause 73 of the Bill. I hope that the noble Baroness, Lady Armstrong, will be happy to withdraw her amendment.

Photo of Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top Chair, Public Services Committee, Chair, Public Services Committee 12:00, 8 March 2021

My Lords, I am grateful to everyone who has taken part and, given the hour, I will be very brief indeed. Therefore, I will not go through each speech.

I thank the Minister for the work that she has done and her recognition of the importance of training and supporting front-line staff. Of course, I would have liked to have seen this more prominently on the face of the Bill, but I accept that she is committed to this, and I will hold her to continuing to pursue the issue through guidance and through support for the commissioner. My noble friend Lord Hunt and I both emphasised the issue of resource for the commissioner to do that effectively.

The only other issue was that raised by my noble friend Lord Hunt: the basic importance of supporting and training staff. That is one of the most important aspects of how we deal with domestic abuse. As Members across the House and, indeed, the Minister said, our knowledge and understanding of this, given the pandemic and what we have learned from that, should be even greater now. We know that those staff themselves need support and training to deal with the real trauma that they go through when dealing with people who are exhibiting these sorts of problems in front of them.

I will not push the amendment further tonight, but I will keep an eye on it once the Bill is through. I will continue to discuss it with the commissioner and continue to bring it back to the House to make sure that the House and the Government have delivered on the commitments that have been given to train and support front-line workers to ask the right questions, so that they then know the right way to guide and direct people who really need that support.

Amendment 15 withdrawn.

Amendment 16 not moved.

Consideration on Report adjourned.

House adjourned at 12.12 am.