Identity Cards

– in the House of Lords at 2:44 pm on 22 May 2007.

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Photo of Baroness Noakes Baroness Noakes Shadow Minister, Treasury 2:44, 22 May 2007

asked Her Majesty's Government:

Whether, in light of the rising costs shown in the latest Identity Cards Scheme Cost Report, they have any plans to review the implementation of the identity cards scheme.

Photo of Baroness Scotland of Asthal Baroness Scotland of Asthal Minister of State, Home Office, Minister of State (Home Office) (Crime Reduction)

No, my Lords. The latest Identity Cards Scheme Cost Report, which sets out the estimate of the likely cost of the scheme over the next 10 years, was published on 10 May this year.

Photo of Baroness Noakes Baroness Noakes Shadow Minister, Treasury

My Lords, I thank the Minister for that reply. I should like to award this month's prize for creative government accounting to her department. The report published last week tries very hard to cover up the fact that the costs went up over the past six months by over £800 million. The total costs over the next 10 years are now calculated at over £6.3 billion, but still exclude costs in a large number of government departments. Does the Minister not agree that the best advice she could give to the incoming Prime Minister is to cut his losses and cancel the scheme?

Photo of Lord Dholakia Lord Dholakia Deputy Leader, House of Lords, Spokesperson in the Lords, Home Affairs

My Lords, under Section 37 of the Identity Cards Act the Government should have produced the costing by 9 April; they did not do so until 10 May. Have the Government broken the law? Has the Minister's department carried out any race equality impact assessment under the new UK Borders Bill, which has implications for identity cards estimated at £200 million? What are the repercussions of that?

Photo of Baroness Scotland of Asthal Baroness Scotland of Asthal Minister of State, Home Office, Minister of State (Home Office) (Crime Reduction)

My Lords, the Government are very sorry that the report due on 9 April was published four weeks late. As noble Lords are aware, we indicated in the second report that we would include the BIA costs, but they were not available until about two days before the report was prepared. Therefore, in order to be consistent with a commitment made by my honourable friend Liam Byrne in the other place on 7 December, we promised to include those costs, and we apologise that the report was a month late. As with all efforts of this nature, we will have assessments made in due course to ensure that they apply appropriately to all our citizens.

Photo of Earl Cathcart Earl Cathcart Conservative

My Lords, one of the arguments used by the retiring Prime Minister is that ID cards would help the police to solve the 900,000-plus unsolved crimes. If this is the case, and if the police are even half successful, what does the Prime Minister-in-waiting intend to do with these hundreds of thousands of newly convicted criminals? Send them, no doubt, to our already overcrowded prisons.

Photo of Baroness Scotland of Asthal Baroness Scotland of Asthal Minister of State, Home Office, Minister of State (Home Office) (Crime Reduction)

My Lords, we hope that the advent of identity cards will help us to better protect individual identities and interdict crime more successfully. Identity theft is a growing scourge that we must tackle and better address. The incoming Prime Minister is as committed to that endeavour as the outgoing one.

Photo of Lord Foulkes of Cumnock Lord Foulkes of Cumnock Labour

My Lords, I urge my noble friend, far from delaying the introduction of the identity card scheme, to consider ways in which it can be speeded up. The sooner we have it in place the better. Will her department consider the possibility of using identity cards for identification purposes at general elections?

Photo of Baroness Scotland of Asthal Baroness Scotland of Asthal Minister of State, Home Office, Minister of State (Home Office) (Crime Reduction)

My Lords, we are introducing the scheme as speedily and as safely as possible and will continue to do so. Identity cards will have a number of valuable uses, one of which may be as my noble friend suggests.

Photo of Lord Geddes Lord Geddes Deputy Chairman of Committees, Deputy Speaker (Lords)

My Lords, does the Minister concur with the cost figures mentioned by my noble friend Lady Noakes?

Photo of Baroness Scotland of Asthal Baroness Scotland of Asthal Minister of State, Home Office, Minister of State (Home Office) (Crime Reduction)

My Lords, I do not. I heard what the noble Baroness said about inflated figures. We do not agree with them. The figures in the report are accurate. The previous report indicated £5.4 billion over 10 years; the current report indicates £5.5 billion and introduces the additional amount of £200 million. Those figures are robust and accurate and we hope that those who have the acuity to understand them will be able to affirm that.

Photo of Lord Tebbit Lord Tebbit Conservative

My Lords, the noble Baroness seems very sure of her figures. Can she tell the House of any other government programme of this size and complexity where the figures have not gone up year by year? Is she now staking her reputation on the concept that these figures will not further escalate?

Photo of Baroness Scotland of Asthal Baroness Scotland of Asthal Minister of State, Home Office, Minister of State (Home Office) (Crime Reduction)

My Lords, I am staking my reputation on the fact that we will endeavour on all occasions to be accurate. Let me remind the House that these figures are predicated on what we already know is the cost of the IPS system and producing the passports. We have real reason to believe that the figures are robust.

Photo of The Countess of Mar The Countess of Mar Crossbench

My Lords, can the Minister guarantee that the computer system for ID cards will successfully co-ordinate every government department required to use them, bearing in mind the disasters that occurred with the NHS, Defra, the Home Office over the original asylum cases, and almost every other major government computer system that I can think of?

Photo of Baroness Scotland of Asthal Baroness Scotland of Asthal Minister of State, Home Office, Minister of State (Home Office) (Crime Reduction)

My Lords, I again remind the House that the UK visa system has been an unmitigated success. The satisfaction rate of all those who have had the privilege of using it is way over 90 per cent. I am sure the House will not hesitate to celebrate that.

Photo of Earl Ferrers Earl Ferrers Conservative

My Lords, was it not introduced by a Conservative Government?