asked Her Majesty's Government:

Whether the 69 new passport interview offices will be fully operational by the deadline of the last quarter of 2006.

My Lords, preparations are well in hand to begin interviews late this year. We want to introduce them as soon as is practicable because of the improvement in confirming identity and fighting passport fraud they will bring, but there is no deadline. It is very important to minimise any risk to the smooth running of passport issuing. Therefore, the new offices will be brought into operation in a controlled phased programme over about three months.

My Lords, I thank the Minister for her Answer although I am surprised that the last quarter deadline is not being adhered to. Many of us are concerned about continual bureaucracy and erosion of civil liberties. First, what will be recorded at personal interviews at the 69 new offices—will it be fingerprints or iris scans? Secondly, will the Minister please inform us of the addresses of the 69 new offices, their staffing and the costs? And—

Noble Lords:

Oh!

This is part of my second question, with your Lordships' indulgence. Given the location of the new offices, many people will have to travel great distances. Will any assistance be given to those needing to travel from, say, the Isle of Lewis to Aberdeen or from Aberdaron to Wrexham?

My Lords, I hope that the noble Lord will be pleased to hear that the locations have all been identified. The roll-out will take place by January/February so there has not been great slippage. Fingerprints and iris recognition will not form part of the interview process. Noble Lords will be aware that the whole issue of facial recognition is ongoing. The addresses of the 69 offices are available. They have been provided. Indeed, I have a map that I am sure the noble Lord would love to see. I hope that I had given great delight to him today.

My Lords, has the Minister taken into account the need for additional resources to deal with applicants who may apply for passports in anticipation of ID cards being introduced soon?

My Lords, we have a clear understanding of the sorts of applications that are likely to be made. We have made appropriate provision. We will still have the check-and-send service that noble Lords will know is available from post offices across the country, so we will be able to check the biographical footprint first. The processes that we are now adopting will be appropriate and speedy. No applicant should have to travel for more than about one hour. If they do, special provisions will be made available for remote communities. All the planning is well in place.

My Lords, when the Government carried out a cost benefit analysis of their proposals, what was their estimate of the additional costs that would be imposed on people who wish to have a passport?

My Lords, we produced an estimate of the costs of this new service last year. Noble Lords will know that that has been included in the estimates. The current programme of face-to-face recognition will enable us to take advantage of a more secure process to help with fraud. Those issues were canvassed long before our debates on identity cards.

My Lords, does my noble friend agree that as evidence suggests terrorists tend to use multiple passports, the use of biometric passports, which is a European requirement—in some senses, an international one—should reduce that use dramatically?

My Lords, I agree with my noble friend. Passport interviews are fully justified by the need to tackle identity fraud through attempts to obtain passports in false or stolen identities. That is the main use we found where the difficulty lies. Passports containing a facial biometric are necessary to meet international standards, as my noble friend has indicated. In due course, as we have discussed, fingerprint records in British passports will be needed to keep up with the security standards of passports issued by other EU member states.

My Lords, will the Minister place in the Library, if she has not already done so, the map that is giving her so much pleasure?

My Lords, I should be delighted to do so. I have a funny feeling that it might already be there, but if not, rest assured that it will be.

My Lords, will the Minister tell the House which computer company has the contract for connecting all the 69 offices? Is it the same company that provides computer services to the National Health Service?

My Lords, the company that has succeeded is Mapeley. I think that it is a different company. The contract was put out to proper tender, which it won on a competitive basis.

My Lords, the Minister seems to be setting great store on facial recognition. I have an example concerning the parents of young twins. A passport application has to be made for each twin at a cost of £50 each, and this very morning, a photograph of one of the twins was returned because the child's mouth was open. Can the Minister help the House by explaining how one can get a child of that age to keep its mouth closed?

My Lords, if any of us knew that we would be very wealthy indeed. In introducing biometric photographs, we will be able to check that the photograph taken meets the required standard. That will make the process easier. The wonderful thing about a digital photograph is that we can keep it still until just the right moment so that the image can be captured correctly.

My Lords, will it be possible to obtain a passport from now on without an interview?

My Lords, it may be because of the roll-out process. We are trying to have face-to-face interviews in relation to new passports. We shall be doing that on a regional basis, and an opportunity will be given to all those obtaining new passports. That will happen on the reissue of passports as fingerprints and other requirements come in. That will be rolled out, but we are talking about the first issue of passports at the moment.

My Lords, will the noble Baroness give an assurance that the computer company running the identity cards contract is not the same as that running the computers for the Rural Payments Agency?

My Lords, we will issue all contracts with the greatest of care and make sure that the best possible supplier is chosen to meet the needs.

My Lords, if the irises and fingerprints are not to be recorded, why does it say on the United Kingdom Passport Service internet site that,

"the public will be able to have their irises and fingerprints recorded"?

Why does it say that if the Minister is contradicting it?

My Lords, people will be able to have irises and fingerprints recorded in due course. We have already identified what the roll-out programme will be and indicated that it is unlikely to take place before 2008. First, it will be the biometric photograph. Subsequently, noble Lords should also know that the offices that we have identified for the face-to-face interviews are likely to be similar to those taking fingerprints in due course, when that falls to be considered.