Part of the debate – in the House of Lords at 11:00 am on 25 June 2004.
Lord Skelmersdale
Shadow Minister, Economic Affairs, Shadow Minister, Public Services, Health & Education, Deputy Chief Whip, Whips
11:00,
25 June 2004
My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Ashley, has a long, distinguished history of looking after the needs and aspirations of disabled people; I salute him for it. More recently, he has turned his attention to those selfless people who look after disabled people. I agree with him and others such as the noble Lord, Lord Pendry, who have made the point that carers, too, need our support.
The trouble with being what my children used to call a House of Lords groupie for so many years is that I remember. I remember other noble Lords who were in their day great advocates of the subjects that we debate in this Chamber regularly. On the plus side, I also have the advantage of seeing the gradual progress made by legislation and society on a great range of subjects.
On carers, like the noble Baroness, Lady Pitkeathley, I recall a period before the noble Lord, Lord Ashley, joined us, when the then noble Baroness, Lady Seear, espoused the lamentable treatment—or lack of it—that carers had received over the years. She would strongly approve of this Bill. She, too, had a strong interest in foreign affairs. I am sure that, having heard the admirable maiden speech of the noble Baroness, Lady Falkner of Margravine, Lady Seear clearly has a most able successor. I am sure that we will hear from her both soon and often on her specialist subject. A word of warning, though: it is sometimes a mistake to be tempted to speak too often.
As the noble Baroness pointed out, we have all been involved with carers, many of us in caring. Certainly, I came across many of them in my 10 years as chairman of the Stroke Association. Over that time I was proud to be involved in an annual award to the carer of the year for a stroke sufferer. The noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, talked about elderly carers, but I can tell her that often the people to whom we gave awards were young carers, sometimes of school age.
Although the Bill will do nothing physical for carers, it builds on two previous Acts, the Carers (Recognition and Services) Act 1995 and the Carers and Disabled Children Act 2000. I confess that I was surprised that the eminently sensible Clause 1 of this Bill was not included in previous legislation. Being of a suspicious frame of mind, I assumed, wrongly as it turned out, that the absence of a duty to inform carers of their right to an assessment of their needs was because of the cost to local authorities. This is the first time that I have shared anything, let alone a suspicion, with the Minister's colleague Dr Ladyman.
That suspicion was unfounded. Carers UK, to which I am most grateful for briefing on the Bill, informed me that discussions were held in connection with the previous Bills but that, being Private Members' Bills, any Amendment could have rocked the boat so much that they may never have become law. I am also told that local authorities believe that there is virtually no extra cost to them in the Bill. However, I note Clause 5, which allows the Government to give local authorities extra money, should it be necessary.
Carers' responsibilities are obvious to everyone; their rights, on the other hand, are not. It is an unfortunate but undeniable fact of life that not all local authorities advise carers fully, hence the need for this Bill. The fact that private carers are estimated to save social services departments up and down the country £57 billion a year, as mentioned by the noble Lord, Lord Morris, and other noble Lords, should not escape our notice. As noble Lords will appreciate, the political fallout of having to add that enormous sum to council tax would be gigantic.
Not only should an assessment of the needs of disabled people be paralleled by an assessment of the needs of the carer, but the needs of the latter should include, by virtue of Clause 2, whether the carer works or wishes to work, or is or wishes to be in education, training or involved in a leisure activity. Replacement carers may be required for those periods when the regular carer pursues those activities. Without a proper assessment, that need would inevitably go unnoticed. I note the Prime Minister's promise in this connection—made during the Big Conversation on, I believe,
Lastly, I will refer to the need for co-operation between statutory services. There is absolutely no point in doing an assessment just for the sake of ticking a box, which the Government would do well to remember when considering targets. Unless it leads to some positive action where necessary, which it frequently will not, we might just as well tear up the whole Bill. Therefore, I am delighted to see in Clause 3 that other local education authorities, housing authorities and the various health authorities are to be informed when the assessing authority believes it to be necessary.
I have a long-term aim in this connection. Ever since having had the honour to serve in Northern Ireland, I have believed that the best way to organise health and social services is to have them provided by the same organisation. Both the Government by their recent activities, and this Bill in getting the health service and local authorities to co-operate more closely, are creeping towards my personal ideal. For the avoidance of doubt, my ambition is not official Conservative policy, but then this is a Private Member's Bill, so I can and will speak for myself. That said, I am speaking not only for myself when I say from these Benches that we support the Bill and hope that the Government will assure it a speedy passage.
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