Address in Reply to Her Majesty's Most Gracious Speech

Part of the debate – in the House of Lords at 9:14 pm on 2 December 2003.

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Photo of Lord Goodhart Lord Goodhart Liberal Democrat 9:14, 2 December 2003

My Lords, I was not protesting against Lord Hailsham, I was protesting against Lord Halsbury, with entire justification should one read about him.

We are therefore truly behind the principle of a judicial appointments commission, but the details are very important and must be got right. I shall turn to three such details. First, ministerial involvement must be restricted. A judicial appointments commission should recommend a single name to a Minister for appointment to a senior post. That Minister, if he vetoes the name, should give the commission reasons for the veto. Secondly, not only the judicial appointments commission, but also those who appoint the members of the commission, should be wholly independent of the Government. Thirdly, we are concerned that it is proposed that the lay membership of the commission be restricted to five out of 15 members.

The third element in the Bill is the abolition of the office of Lord Chancellor. I believe that is inevitable because the Lord Chancellor, as head of a major government department, cannot now sit as a member of the judiciary, let alone act as head of the judiciary.

I therefore turn to the more controversial of the two major Bills; namely, reform of your Lordships' House. I welcome a number of sensible speeches from the Conservative Benches with which I agree; notably, those made by the noble Earl, Lord Onslow, and the noble Lord, Lord Lucas. We, and our predecessors in the Liberal Party, have been campaigning since the Parliament Act 1911 for the complete removal of the hereditary membership of your Lordships' House and its replacement by a democratic system of election.

We came agonisingly close to that goal in February when the proposal for an 80 per cent elected membership came within three votes of a majority in the House of Commons. I do not believe that the Government are entitled to rely on the absence of a majority in the House of Commons when they, through the Prime Minister, are responsible for the failure to achieve that majority. Those in all parties who have campaigned for a democratic second Chamber felt a strong sense of betrayal.

We are now to get a Bill that does no more than remove the remaining hereditaries and to set up a statutory appointments commission to appoint non-party Members. We are in favour of those changes, but we want them not as ends in themselves but as steps towards our real objective; namely, a second Chamber in which most or all of its Members are elected. Our attitude to any Bill brought forward by the Government will depend on whether we see the Bill as furthering that aim.

Taken by themselves, the Government's proposals are merely window dressing. They will enable the Government to wash their hands of further reform. What was unfinished business in 1911 will remain as unfinished in 2004 and, if the Government have their way, for many years thereafter. I disagree with the noble Lords, Lord Morgan, Lord Faulkner of Worcester and Lord Hoyle, who said that they would vote for the Government because their proposals are a start. The Government—as the noble Lord, Lord Butler of Brockwell, made clear, he thought, and supported—believe that those proposals are not the start, but the end. As my noble friend Lord Smith of Clifton said, that means that we in your Lordships' House will end up as the biggest quango of all.

I am aware that a large majority of Members of your Lordships' House, including my noble friend Lord Dahrendorf and a number of other noble friends, voted for a wholly-appointed House. Therefore, I should explain why I believe that election is so important. It is only the election of the political Members of your Lordships' House that can give it the strength to carry out its proper constitutional role. Expertise and distinction of appointed Members, however great, will not give us that strength.

What is the role of your Lordships' House? First, of course, as a revising Chamber, but revision is not just a matter of correcting errors and oversights; if the role is to be meaningful, we must be able to make amendments that are not wrecking but which are nevertheless substantial and sometimes controversial. When we have done that, we have been doing no more than our duty. We must have the strength to force the Government to negotiate.

However, your Lordships' House is also the guardian of last resort of the constitution. In the end, the House of Commons can have its way through the Parliament Acts, but the power of your Lordships' House to challenge and delay legislation that it believes to be unconstitutional is vital and part of the checks and balances of the constitution. That power is weakened if, as happened last week, the Government can rubbish us as an unelected House.

Of course, there are drawbacks to an elected House.