Oral Answers to Questions — Business, Innovation and Skills – in the House of Commons at 9:30 am on 8 November 2012.
Russell Brown
Labour, Dumfries and Galloway
9:30,
8 November 2012
If he will establish an independent body to review the relationship between big pub companies and tied landlords.
Lisa Nandy
Labour, Wigan
If he will establish an independent body to review the relationship between big pub companies and tied landlords.
Andrew Gwynne
Shadow Minister (Health)
If he will establish an independent body to review the relationship between big pub companies and tied landlords.
Jo Swinson
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Women and Equalities, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills
The Secretary of State has written to the industry asking for evidence on how the self-regulatory approach announced last November is working. We will make our decisions after considering its response.
Russell Brown
Labour, Dumfries and Galloway
I thank the Minister for that answer, but a broad coalition of organisations as diverse as the Campaign for Real Ale, the Federation of Small Businesses, the Business, Innovation and Skills Committee, which has a Majority of coalition members, the all-party save the pub group, Unite and the GMB—the list goes on—all think that the relationship between pubcos and their licensees is unfair. Is the Minister able to name any serious organisation that thinks that self-regulation will work in this sector?
Jo Swinson
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Women and Equalities, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills
I understand that a wide range of organisations have expressed concerns, which is exactly why we have written to the industry to ask for its views on how this is working. We want to proceed on an evidence-based approach and once we receive the evidence we will report back to the House.
Lisa Nandy
Labour, Wigan
In Wigan, we are proud of our small breweries, AllGates and Prospect, whose beer will be in this place very soon. An independent inquiry would allow us to consider the impact of restrictions on their trade and, in particular, the impact on our local economy, given the breweries’ importance to Wigan. A commitment today from the Minister to establish such an inquiry would go a long way to restoring confidence in the industry. Will she make that commitment?
Jo Swinson
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Women and Equalities, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills
I thank the hon. Lady for her question. She does a wonderful job in championing her local breweries and the BIS Committee was very positive about the relationship that family brewers have with tenants. I may have to disappoint her by not giving her the commitment that she asks for today, but the Government are open-minded. As I have said, when we receive the industry’s response, which we have asked for by
Andrew Gwynne
Shadow Minister (Health)
On
Jo Swinson
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Women and Equalities, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills
I do not think that that is an accurate representation of my view. I came into the post just a couple of months ago and I am looking at the issue very seriously. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has written to the industry and it is appropriate to proceed on an evidence base. Once we receive the written responses, discussions will be required with the industry and, as I have said, we will return to the House with further information on what has been presented to us.
Bob Stewart
Conservative, Beckenham
Will the Minister outline how she, as the Government’s representative, might help independent freehold houses generate business and, in particular, line up with independent mini-breweries?
Jo Swinson
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Women and Equalities, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills
I thank my hon. Friend for that question. It is certainly interesting that three quarters of the new pubs that have opened in the last year and a bit have been freehold. That says a lot about how people who are looking to set up pubs feel about the business models. The Minister of State, Department for Business, Innovation and Skills, my right hon. Friend Michael Fallon outlined some of the initiatives of global entrepreneurship week. The Government have a raft of measures to support small businesses. I know that Members from all parts of the House want to support small community businesses in their constituencies, including small breweries.
Toby Perkins
Shadow Minister (Business, Innovation and Skills)
The Minister says that she wants to hear from the industry. If she has looked into this matter, she will know that the entire industry was united in thinking that the Government’s response last November was too weak. The Secretary of State said in June 2010 that he would support the commitments made by the previous Government, and this House set out its clear view in January 2012. Now, years after all the Select Committee reviews, we have yet another consultation. Why does the Minister not listen to the view of this House, listen to the view of the industry and set up an independent review of whether self-regulation is working? Let us start saving some jobs and pubs before it is too late.
Jo Swinson
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Women and Equalities, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills
I am listening; that is the purpose of asking the industry how the current approach is working. There are positive signs, such as the setting up of the Pubs Advisory Service and the Pubs Independent Conciliation and Arbitration Service. PICAS has started to hear cases and two have been found in favour of the tenants. There has been positive action and we need to assess whether that is sufficient. That is what the gathering of evidence is designed to do.
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