What plans the Government have to reorganise police forces in Wales.

In the light of recommendations made recently by Her Majesty's inspector of constabulary, my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary has asked the police service to come forward with firm proposals for the future of policing in England and Wales to meet the new challenge of terrorism, serious crime and drug trafficking.

One of the chief constables has already estimated that the cost of that reorganisation will be £10 million to £12 million, plus the entire reserves of all four police authorities in Wales. Can the Secretary of State demonstrate his undoubted command of mental arithmetic and tell us how many police officers could be trained and put on to the crime-ridden streets of Wales for the same sum that will be needed to create this unaccountable bureaucratic monolith?

First, as a Gwent MP, I am sure the hon. Gentleman will want to join me in congratulating Mike Tonge, chief constable of Gwent, who is today receiving the Queen's Police medal in recognition of his distinguished service.

As regards the hon. Gentleman's rant on this matter, may I invite him, instead of ranting, to display a bit of objectivity? On the figures he quoted from the chief constable of South Wales, which were given at a private meeting to which the hon. Gentleman was invited, she said that her best estimate was that the start-up costs would be about £10 million. She could not be certain, so the hon. Gentleman has upped that figure by a couple of million. She also said that she thought the savings would be three times as much. Why did the hon. Gentleman not raise that point and why did he not make it in the very biased account he gave to the South Wales Argus the other day?

Is it not true that the forces of Wales have the best record of any in the United Kingdom, especially Gwent and Dyfed-Powys? This reorganisation is being forced on Wales for the benefit of English cities. If there is a need for a special emphasis on the problems of serious crime, drugs and terrorism, why not form a special unit and leave those splendid forces intact?

My hon. Friend will surely join other hon. Members, especially Welsh Members, in wanting a Welsh police service that is not only doing a very good job, as in Gwent, on neighbourhood policing and other matters, but that can also confront the new challenges of terrorism, drug trafficking and international serious organised crime. The fact is that apart from the South Wales force, which is near the optimum number suggested by Her Majesty's inspectorate of constabulary to fight those challenges, none of the other forces is anything like the size necessary to do so. We should consider the all-Wales option, but keep the principle of local neighbourhood policing sacrosanct and make sure that, as in Gwent, there is an element of regional accountability still built into the system, so that the identities of the regions currently organised into police forces are maintained, especially in north Wales.

The police grant has been insufficient to meet some of the demands of the police authorities, such as pensions. As a result, the council tax precept has gone up by much more than inflation, on top of the recent rebanding of properties. What assessments has the Secretary of State made of the effect of the possible amalgamation of police forces on a potential rise in council tax across Wales?

I have made no such assessments. As I pointed out earlier, however, considerable savings will be possible, which will enable resources to be released not only to fight the new threats, but to make sure that we have as many police officers as possible on the ground in our neighbourhoods. Since our Government came to power, Wales has had 950 extra police officers and 270 extra community support officers on patrol. We are driving that forward with even more recruits and even more effective neighbourhood policing in future.

Does my right hon. Friend agree that, in line with the strategic reorganisation of the police, it is also vital that we continue the strategy of neighbourhood policing? Will he join me in applauding the work of my right hon. Friend Mr. Blunkett, who as Home Secretary did so much in driving forward the agenda of community safety and community policing?

Indeed, I am happy to do so. My right hon. Friend Mr. Blunkett did a great job in making sure that neighbourhood policing was a priority of every police force, which is increasingly the case. We much regret the fact that he is no longer able to discharge his responsibilities. In any future reorganisation of policing, neighbourhood policing must remain the bedrock, and the basic police command units will continue to take that agenda forward.

Where will the final decision on this contentious and potentially damaging force merger be made—Wales or Whitehall?

Obviously, I will have an input from Wales, as will the Welsh Assembly Government. Indeed, the Home Secretary has written specifically to the Welsh Assembly Government inviting their views and an Assembly Committee is currently considering the matter. We need a police system in Wales that meets the big new challenges. A terrorist suspect has been arrested recently in Cardiff, and others are known to be active in south Wales. We need to deal with the problems of drug trafficking and serious organised crime, and the Labour Government are doing that. If Plaid Cymru wants to opt out of confronting those challenges, that is a matter for it. We are rising to meet those challenges and we want a good police service in the whole of Wales that confronts those big challenges and preserves community policing.