Part of the debate – in the House of Commons at 12:00 am on 24 July 1978.
The hon. Member for Southampton, Itchen (Mr. Mitchell), with his own practical experience of industry and unemployment in his area—perhaps one might note that it is in the south of England—brought a much greater degree of reality to the debate than did the wholly deplorable performance of the Minister of State. The Minister is a very nice man indeed, but I can understand his shame and embarrassment after the devastating attack of my hon. Friend the Member for Brentford and Isleworth (Mr. Hayhoe), who made an admirable speech. When I was in office, the Minister led a deputation to me about unemployment in Doncaster, and there were tears in his eyes. Today the unemployment figures there are twice what they were in those days, and he is laughing. I can well understand the difficulty in which he find himself, because by any standards the present state of unemployment is absolutely disgraceful and a scandal.
Nowadays it is fashionable in some circles to say that because inflation is our major problem, and because unemployment pay is high and, indeed, often abused, the basic problem of unemployment can be relegated to the back seat in economic and social thinking. That is very dangerously wrong. Indeed, history has shown that much of our troubles—politically, socially and philosophically—are attributable to the insensitivity shown on this subject in the last century, and certainly between the wars. I believe that the present Government, although not only the present Government, have in recent times tended to pay lip service to this question because of the social services benefits which are now, quite rightly, available.
But we do this at our peril. Unemployment can mean different things to different people. To some it is regarded only as a means of conquering inflation. Things are not as black and white as that. To others it means a lot of idle people who will not work even if given the opportunity. I do not accept that. To some it is merely an interesting exercise in computerised statistics to be mulled over around dinner at high table at universities. Of course, to the oddballs who sit below the Gangway on the Labour Benches, it is regarded as a justification for the totalitarian Socialist State which they require. But to the person who cannot find work it means a degradation of the human spirit. To young people it is regarded as an excuse to turn their backs on a society that offers them no hope.
I am not so surprised at the unfortunate episodes of football hooliganism, and even vandalism, when one reflects how hopeless seems the future for some of these people. Of course, inflation is the root cause of long-term unemployment. Of course it is dangerous to reflate in a panic in order to overcome it. Of course—I know that there is a difference of view on both sides of the House—the imposition of import controls may be regarded as the easiest solution. However, I believe, as I am happy to note do the Government, that that would be lunacy in view of our dependence on world trade as a whole.
It is true that in a free society market forces will always prevail. It is also true to say that the present unacceptably high figures of unemployment are a direct result of the Government's failure to act sooner than they did. Having said all that, I believe that my hon. Friend the Member for Reigate (Mr. Gardiner) was right to warn recently that there is no painless solution to this problem, although there is a duty upon Government to mitigate its appalling effects.
I want to direct my remarks to one aspect for which I had some responsibility—the question of unemployment being a regional problem. When unemployment rises, certain areas always suffer most. When it falls, inflationary pressures inevitably build up in the prosperous parts. The regional nature of unemployment has some very weird effects. For example, the level of unemployment in greater London today, at over 5 per cent., is as high as it was in the development areas three years ago. Yet week after week in my local newspaper there is page after page of advertisements for a wide range of jobs. What is even more odd is that there are similar advertisements in newspapers circulating in areas of high unemployment such as the north-east.
But these advertisements are largely for skills. Therefore, in my judgment a much greater effort must be made in relation to retraining as well as a much greater disincentive to those who refuse to undertake it. I do not believe that by any manner of means are retraining opportunities taken up as they should be. This must be given a much higher priority, and it requires a more imaginative approach than the Government are at present showing.
My hon. Friend the Member for Brent-ford and Isleworth was absolutely right when he said that there must be a greater degree of mobility of labour. The appalling immobility of labour, which is so damaging to our productive performance, is largely due to many years of absolutely crazy housing legislation which, as my hon. Friend said, rooted people, fixed and immovable, in places when they could find work elsewhere. To a lesser extent, I believe that our over-rigid education system prevents the mobility of labour. Therefore, it is high time that we reviewed the whole question of regional policy.
I merely make these suggestions for Ministers to consider when they are thinking about this subject, if indeed they do think about it. The time has come to rethink the whole question of bringing jobs to people rather than people to jobs. We must rethink the assisted area boundaries. For example, some of the latest figures show that the rise in unemployment in areas such as the Midlands and East Anglia is faster than in the development areas. It is also crazy to provide the same blanket benefits to the prosperous North Sea oil areas of Scotland, or for that matter for the sheep in the Highlands, as it is to west central Scotland. The present system of regional policy lends itself to a disease which I call "creeping regionalisation", which simply results in the jam—what there is of it—being spread far too thinly.
Therefore, much greater flexibility is required, provided that it is consistent with the need to give industry some degree of certainty for the future. We must remember that industry has to plan a long way ahead and that it cannot stand too much disturbance.
Again, should we continue to rely on straight cash incentives to get industry to locate in certain areas, or would really imaginative new tax incentives for both companies and individuals be more likely to encourage new growth? In this sense, I welcome the contribution to thought on this subject from my right hon. and learned Friend the Member for Hexham (Mr. Rippon). Remarkably little comes from Government supporters. However, my right hon. and learned Friend's ideas contributed some valuable suggestions.
Can we really go on with the present policy of IDCs as they are now? They have a function to fulfil at a certain level, but I believe that they have got completely out of tune with reality, certainly in London and the south-east. Can we really go on with office permits development and all this panoply which has been the thinking in regional policy for so many years and which I accept the previous Government used as well? I believe that largely they are very much out of date.
There is an even more fundamental long-term problem concerned with unemployment to which I wish to refer briefly. It is, of course, structural unemployment. We are idle if we pretend that it does not exist. Everyone says that we want investment. The Government say that they need investment, and that to get out of our difficulties we need investment. But investment of the sort necessary, which is technological investment, inevitably means more unemployment. It happens automatically. There is no hope for us in the modern world if we do not instal the machines which are used in modem industry. There is no hope for us if industry instals machines which can do the work of six men and which keeps those six men ostensibly minding a machine but in reality playing cards. In some ways it would be more honest and realistic for the State to pay them to play cards if we could afford it, which of course we cannot.
The real world has moved far beyond the thinking of this Government in this and many other respects. We delude ourselves if we imagine that in Britain we can go on creating jobs which can be done and are being done more cheaply and more speedily in other parts of the globe.
We shall have to live with unemployment for a very long time. I believe that considerable impact can be made on it, undoubtedly, by small firms. I have practical experience, and I can tell hon. Members that firms which I know and with which I am concerned would take on more employment of a modest nature but make a contribution to the problem of unemployment if some of the shackles of Government and legislation were removed from their shoulders.
But this will still leave us with a very substantial unemployment level for the future. Therefore, I do not want to resume my seat with anyone having the impression that the problem will be solved overnight. Undoubtedly a Tory Government are coming in, but it would be quite wrong to suppose that the problem will be solved overnight. It is that sort of cynicism which has created so much damage to the body politic and made people so sour in their views of Government.
In this respect, I cite a particularly disgraceful example. Of all the guilty
men, the most guilty is the Leader of the House. In a debate in 1971, he spoke from the then Opposition Front Bench. At the time, we had an unemployment level of 600,000. The right hon. Gentleman said:
We on these benches are determined to speak loud on this question of unemployment, day after day, week after week, month after month, until the policy is changed. Many of us were not satisfied with the policy followed during the previous six years. Many of us expressed our dissatisfaction with an unemployment total of 600,000. Many of us fought it, and we shall continue to fight it. Reshaped policies will be needed to reduce it.—[Official Report, 5th May 1971; Vol. 816, c. 1492.]
How things have changed with the course of events. Now the right hon. Gentleman has the reins of power in his hands, and he has had them for four years. He has had four years in which to reshape policies. Far from being reduced unemployment has more than doubled. Where is that loud voice now? All that we hear is a puny whine and the sound of wringing of hands blaming everyone else except himself, now that he has his feet under the table and his fingers in the gravy.
It is because of this cynicism that I believe that much of our political affairs have been soured in the eyes of people. It has clone a great disservice. So I beg that none of my right hon. and hon. Friends will give the impression that this problem can be solved overnight. It is because of the cynicism of the Government over a major fundamental problem that I believe they will be rejected, for this reason among many others, by the people who hitherto have been their traditional supporters. It is for that reason that I propose to vote against this Government tonight.