Commencement

Part of Orders of the Day — Wales Bill – in the House of Commons at 12:00 am on 19 April 1978.

Alert me about debates like this

Photo of Mr Ioan Evans Mr Ioan Evans , Aberdare 12:00, 19 April 1978

I was trying to answer the hon. Member for Caernarvon, Mr. Murton. I agree that I should return to the amendment.

The clause as it stands is better than it would be if amended. Surely the reason for the clause being vague is not that the Government do not want to be more specific but that legislation which flows from decisions of this place and another place is dependent upon the progress of measures in this place and another place. To write in a Bill of this nature a commencement date of 1st January 1979 is a terrible presumption. It is being said that this Parliament must aim at that date and must get the Bill through, even if it is inadequately discussed, simply to get it on the statute book by that time. I am sure that that is not in the mind of the hon. Member for Cardigan, but that is what his form of words would mean.

The hon. Gentleman says that what we need is action, not words, but before one gets the actions one must have the form of words. The important consideration is to arrive at the correct form of words so that one will not have incorrect actions. I believe that the actions that would flow if the amendments tabled by the hon. Member for Cardigan were carried would make the Bill worse than it now is.

The sad thing is that there are whole areas of the Bill which have not been debated. We must remember that we are dealing with a major constitutional issue. We are told that the House of Lords will examine the Bill through a microscope, but there are some clauses which hon. Members in this Committee have not even seen through a telescope. We have had no sight of them at all. Because of the mass of amendments tabled by the Welsh nationalists, we shall be denied an opportunity to debate fully the subject of the referendum.