Orders of the Day — Armed Forces Bill

Part of the debate – in the House of Commons at 12:00 am on 10 December 1975.

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Photo of Mr Frank Allaun Mr Frank Allaun , Salford East 12:00, 10 December 1975

It is clear that the hon. Gentleman has not been listening to my argument. I have been outlining what the result would be in cash terms if we came down to the level of our main European NATO allies. I think that he should have followed that.

What could not the present Government or any Government do with £1,400 million a year? What a transformation of life that would mean for the homeless, for those who cannot find a nursery school for their children and, for the housebound, the elderly and the disabled who are desperately seeking a home help. Instead, the public are faced with a threat of worsening living standards and conditions. Once again we are faced with the old question of whether we are to have houses or H-bombs.

I hope that Conservative Members will not think that it is a handful of Labour Members who say that if there is to be a choice the choice should be houses.

The hon. Member for Beckenham (Mr. Goodhart), who has unfortunately left the Chamber, will no doubt reply, in view of his letter to The Times yesterday, that our gross national product is lower than that of either France or Germany. That is exactly my point. Our industry is doing badly and it needs to be devoted to productive rather than to military purposes. It is unfair and unrealistic to expect a poorer country to devote a higher proportion of its wealth to arms than a more prosperous nation. Surely not even the most reactionary Conservative Member would ask a man on a low income to pay a higher rate of income tax than someone with a top income.

To take up the point made by the right hon. and learned Member for Hexham (Mr. Rippon), vast armed forces do not provide security. A dozen hydrogen bombs delivered on our country would decimate the centres of population and the dying would envy the dead. There is no weapon that the right hon. and learned Gentleman or anyone else on this earth has devised which can prevent the delivery of hydrogen bombs by missile. There is no military security to be obtained by doubling, trebling or quadrupling our arms expenditure and completely bankrupting the nation.