Counties and Metropolitan Districts in England

Part of Schedule 1 – in the House of Commons at 12:00 am on 6 July 1972.

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Photo of Alan Haselhurst Alan Haselhurst , Middleton and Prestwich 12:00, 6 July 1972

In supporting the Amendment moved by my hon. Friend the Member for Bury and Radcliffe (Mr. Fidler) I pay tribute to the energy and determination which he has shown in representing the views of his constituents and the sustained campaign he has maintained on this issue. For reasons which will be apparent, I have not at all times been able to stand by him during his campaign. On this occasion I stand foursquare with him in supporting these Amendments. The whole of my constituency is affected, though in varying degrees.

All three towns support Amendment No. 1020 and linked Amendments. I state that lest it be thought that their voices have been muted on this issue. Whitefield is the smallest town in the constituency and lies geographically on the Bury border. It found itself, under the arrangements of the White Paper, in District 12F from the beginning. That was confirmed in the Bill. Whitefield did not quarrel with that fact. It did not have any particular reason for wanting to transfer itself from one district to another. Nevertheless, the locally-held view in Whitefield supported Bury in Bury's fight to separate itself from Rochdale. That view has been endorsed by a minute of the urban district council. As the Member for Whitefield I have been urged to support that view.

5.0 p.m.

As a result of the White Paper Prestwich found itself in District 12D, and very much resisted that proposition. There was very strong opposition developing locally, and persuasion on the Government proved successful. When the Bill was published Prestwich found itself in District 12C, and there was a sigh of relief as a result. Prestwich still had a view on the matter of further development with regard to Bury and Rochdale but perhaps did not feel that it was altogether gracious to push its luck in seeking another major change in the Bill.

When we turn to Middleton, the position needs rather more careful explanation. The position of Middleton can be shown to have been one that has not lacked responsibility throughout. I have to admit that the first response of any self-respecting Middletonian to the idea of local government reorganisation was that he did not want to know, that Middleton was "all right as it was, thank you." I imagine that this is an impression which right hon. and hon. Members have found many times in their own areas.

In fairness to Middleton, it also recognised that some sort of local government reorganisation had to come and on its own account was involved in discussions with neighbouring urban district councils ahead of the publication of the Bill. The White Paper put Middleton under District 12F. The council was reluctant to take a decision either to approve or disapprove because it did not feel that sufficient information was available on which it could base a sensible decision. In any case it thought that as the only alternative to being in District 12F, centred on Oldham, was to be in a metropolitan district which included Rochdale and Bury it did not feel that the choice gave it any great determination to escape from District 12F.

After months of consideration the Middleton Borough Council decided that if there was a possibility of a metropolitan district including Rochdale and Heywood but excluding Bury that was what it would wish. It took that decision before the Bill was published. After it was published and Middleton was still placed in District 12F the council decided to accept this, regretfully, feeling that the matter was finally settled and that what should be done was to co-operate in the setting-up of the new district.

It was certainly apparent to me and, I believe, many people in Middleton over a period of months since the publication of the White Paper that the people of Middleton were far from delighted at the prospect of being in District 12F. As awareness grew of Rochdale's fight for separation from Bury and for the creation of two metropolitan districts, so the people in Middleton were asking in louder voices why it was that there could not be a link-up between Middleton and Rochdale.

I recently felt it right to put this matter once again to the Middleton Council and to say: if there was a chance of a Rochdale-based metropolitan district, did it wish to be in that district, did it wish Middleton's voice to be heard in support of that proposition? The only convenient body at the time able to consider that question was the finance and general purposes committee of the council, although this has been the body which has, all along, formulated policy on reorganization matters. I was duly informed that Middleton would prefer to be in Rochdale. This was in March of this year. I also made it clear in the local paper, the Middleton Guardian, that the door might not be finally shut on the possibility of a change, and I invited comments.

The result was a considerable number of letters and mini-petitions. These amount to practically a 14 to 1 vote in favour of Middleton being linked with Rochdale rather than Oldham. All of us realise what might be termed a significant amount of correspondence on any issue. If one has an electorate of 35,000 one does not expect to be getting 5 per cent., 10 per cent. or 15 per cent. of letters on any subject. There have been a total of 378 names and addresses submitted mostly in individual letters and the rest in the form of mini-petitions, with 352 expressing themselves in favour of being in Rochdale and 26 against. The letters come from all parts of the town including the large Langley overspill estate which draws its population largely from Manchester.

Some of the things said in the letters are rather interesting. One lady says: I did not know we had any choice. We were told we were going with Oldham. Middleton people were not even consulted. Someone else said: I feel sad…to see, like many others, that it was no use protesting about the link-up with Oldham as the powers-that-be would please themselves anyway, whatever we ordinary people feel about it. One other lady wrote to me: Last night, 12 days after my resolve to write to you I realised that time might be running short and that probably many of your constituents, like me, had decided to write and had let the opportunity slip. So I decided to canvass my neighbours for an hour or so. The result is the enclosed list of signatures. Every person I approached was most anxious to sign—some had intended to write. This proves to me how lazy we all are and we deserve just what we get. However, I do hope that you will succeed in getting the decision that Middleton be merged with Oldham altered. These remarks back up the clear message I have received at all the gatherings that I have attended in Middleton in the past few months. I am satisfied that the overwhelming view of the people of Middleton is in favour of these Amendments which would allow them to be linked with Rochdale.

It is also my duty to say that I received yesterday a resolution signed by 15 Labour members of the Middleton Council which supported Middleton staying in District 12F. I am equally bound to point out that this does not represent the entire Labour group on the Middleton Council. This is a matter which cuts across party lines as my hon. Friend the Member for Bury and Radcliffe pointed out so adequately. I am also satisfied that, had there been time for a full meeting of the council to be properly convened to discuss this matter, then on a free vote it would once again have reflected support for Rochdale in preference to Oldham, in line with all its previous decisions.

When it comes to the merits of choice I will be frank with my right hon. Friend. It is not very easy to show the various considerations that can be taken into account in terms of amenities and finance and so on as being decisive one way or the other. Lord Redcliffe-Maud and Mr. Derek Senior who wrote a dissenting report at the time could certainly adduce no convincing reasons for placing Middleton with Oldham as they did. Mr. Senior was quite open about the difficulty. In paragraph 590 of Cmnd. 4040 he wrote: Among other finely balanced decisions in which I have no great confidence, but which I have not yet had adequate cause to reverse, are the inclusion of Middleton in the Oldham rather than the Rochdale unit. The impression might be given from all this that Middleton was being placed in the Government's White Paper more according to what seemed most convenient to fit in on a map being drawn up rather than because there was an absolutely overwhelming and outstanding case based on other considerations to place it in one direction or another. After all, an earlier local government commission had placed Middleton with Rochdale, and this had also been the view of the Lancashire County Council at one time.

I have tried to balance these considerations. What weighs with me is that I believe there is a closer natural affinity between Rochdale and Middleton than between Middleton and Oldham and I believe also from the point of view of my constituents that there will be greater scope for development if Middleton is linked in an area with Rochdale.

But surely the thing that matters most where other considerations are not absolutely clear-cut is what the people themselves want. I submit that there is an overwhelming majority in Middleton which wants to be with Rochdale and shuns Oldham. This view is backedup effectively by Prestwich and Whitefield's desire to see a Rochdale/Bury split. This is further endorsed by the views of Rochdale and Bury themselves, and the other authorities mentioned by my hon. Friend the Member for Bury and Radcliffe. In short, almost everybody wants to see this change brought about. I am sorry if Oldham and the other members of District 12 (f) do not now want to see this, but my responsibility is to speak for my constituents and I am very clear in my mind as to what the views of my constituents are. Whilst there may be financial considerations which affect the minds of the good citizens of Oldham, again not from any party consideration, I would also have to back the remark made by the hon. Member for Heywood and Royton (Mr. Joel Barnett) about democracy. I believe it would be a triumph for democracy if the people in my constituency, thinking overwhelmingly as they do, had their views taken into account by my right hon. Friend in this connection.

My right hon. Friend could very easily grant my request in that we are not seeking in this Amendment to upset in any radical way the basic principle underlying the Government's reorganisation plans. We are not challenging the concept of the metropolitan county. We are not seeking to transfer powers from district to county, or vice versa. We are saying in effect that we accept all this in principle. All we are asking is that an extra metropolitan district be created. We say that this can be done without upsetting the Government's overall plan, and we say it should be done in order to create the greatest good will among the greatest number of people to ensure that the new authorities are launched under the most promising auspices.