Orders of the Day — PLYMOUTH AND SOUTH WEST DEVON WATER BILL (By Order)

Part of the debate – in the House of Commons at 12:00 am on 14 April 1970.

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Photo of Mr Douglas Jay Mr Douglas Jay , Battersea North 12:00, 14 April 1970

I intervene briefly because I happen to know every part of Dartmoor extremely well and believe that this is the most beautiful part of the British Isles. However, like the hon. Member for Tavistock (Mr. Michael Heseltine), I am not a fanatical preserver in all circumstances, even of Dartmoor. I think that the Forestry Commission has enhanced the beauty of Dartmoor in many places as well as improving its productive value. I also believe, like the hon. Lady the Member for Plymouth, Devonport (Dame Joan Vickers), that probably the existing three reservoirs—not merely Burrator but Hexworthy and Ferrworthy reservoirs—although this is more arguable, have probably enhanced the beauty of these areas.

On the other hand, I thought that the hon. Lady was going a little far when she sought—and here I may be misrepresenting her—to brush aside the aesthetic arguments on the ground that this was rather a bleak and lonely spot and, particularly, that it was largely a bog. My hon. Friend the Member for Bristol, North-West (Mr. Ellis) wanted to know whether it was bleak or beautiful. The factual answer to that is that it depends on the weather, as in a great many parts of Dartmoor, and on the time of year. Certainly many areas, including this one, can look bleak and in some sorts of weather can look exceedingly beautiful. This is admittedly a much less beautiful part of the moor than the Meldon Valley, which is pre-eminently beautiful but is now a closed issue.

Therefore I do not think that we should write off the aesthetic argument nor think that because Fox Tor Mire, is a bog that it is not an area worth preserving. I think that the hon. Lady will agree that a very large part of Dartmoor is a bog, including many of the most beautiful, wildest and impressive parts of it. Frankly, I found on the issue as it is presented tonight that it is exceedingly difficult to make one's mind for or against. I say to the hon. Member for Torrington (Mr. Peter Mills) that none of us would be as foolish as to say that Plymouth or South-West Devon should not have an adequate water supply. But that is not the issue. The issue is whether this is the best way of finding that water supply in a reasonable period among all the possible alternatives.

I am impressed by those who argued tonight that a Select Committee was not the best way of reaching a decision and that some of the important interests—as indeed happens in other cases—would be excluded either for administrative reasons or because they could not afford the costs of engaging the specialists who are necessary. It seems to me that my hon. Friend the Member for Lewisham, South (Mr. Carol Johnson) did make out a case for using a planning inquiry commission in circumstances of this kind. I do not think it is enough to say that in the case of Meldon seven years was occupied. In the first place, Meldon could not have planning permission because that was only introduced by the Act of 1968, which could hardly have been in force in 1962 which was the relevant date according to hon. Members opposite. An inquiry should not take as long as that. I should have thought two years would be enough. On the evidence of the memorandum from the Devon County Council, it does not seem to me that the case for extra urgency has as yet been made out.

I should like to ask the Minister if, supposing this Bill were rejected tonight and the planning application were made whether it would be possible within the existing law for the Government to appoint a planning inquiry commission to go into the whole of this problem and the alternatives and to hear evidence from all the interested bodies and whether it could be done in a reasonable period of time not exceeding two years. We should know this from the Minister and if it were possible I think that some powerful arguments have been advanced for not giving the Bill a Second Reading this evening.