Clause 1. — (FINANCES OF RAILWAYS BOARD, WATERWAYS BOARD AND LONDON BOARD, 1962 c. 46.)

Part of Orders of the Day — Transport Finances Bill – in the House of Commons at 12:00 am on 20 May 1966.

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Photo of Sir John Morris Sir John Morris Parliamentary Secretary (Ministry of Transport) 12:00, 20 May 1966

We have listened to an interesting speech from the hon. Member for Worcester (Mr. Peter Walker). I thought that by some quirk of the procedures of the House of Commons we were back in a Second Reading debate, but I presume that the hon. Member was dealing with the Amendments by which he seeks to alter some of the provisions of the Bill. I would have hoped that in the course of his speech the hon. Member would come to the Amendments and would explain the meaning of the Amendments which he seeks to persuade the Committee to adopt.

We recall the difficulties that we experienced the other night on Second Reading. It would be wrong if I were to accuse the hon. Member for Ormskirk (Sir D. Glover), who is not present, of over-cleverness; that would be malicious. I suppose that it would even be malicious if I were to accuse him of cleverness. I doubt, however, whether he realises the predicament in which he might have landed us in the course of his contribution that, night. This was an indication of the difficulties that arise from time to time.

The hon. Member for Worcester is still in cloud-cuckoo-land if he believes that White Papers and policies can be decided after merely a few moments of thought. The essential reason for the Bill, as my right hon. Friend the Minister has indicated, is that we must have stop-gap legislation of this type to ensure that British Railways and the other industries have money with which to carry out their existing statutory requirements until we are able first, to present our White Paper to the House of Commons and, secondly, to bring it into effect.

All this takes time. I have here the precedents which show how long it took hon. Gentlemen on the other side of the Committee to bring in the Bill which became the 1962 Act. I shall come to that in due course. If the hon. Gentleman believes we have been able to change the procedures of the House of Commons, or the procedures necessary for full discussion and consultation since 1962, to ensure there would be a major change in transport policy within the time scale we have, so far as the moneys required by British Railways are concerned, then he is tremendously mistaken.