Orders of the Day — National Insurance (Industrial Injuries)

Part of the debate – in the House of Commons at 12:00 am on 7 February 1966.

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Photo of Mr Geoffrey Howe Mr Geoffrey Howe , Bebington 12:00, 7 February 1966

I join with the Joint Parliamentary Secretary in paying tribute to all concerned with this Act and these schemes for the speed with which the schemes have been brought before the House in accordance with the undertakings given when the Measure was receiving its Second Reading. As my hon. Friend the Member for Wokingham (Mr. van Straubenzee) then made clear, we on this side at that time gave our undertaking to do everything possible to get the provisions implemented as quickly as possible, and we are glad to be able to do so.

It is rather a solemn reflection that, as the hon. Gentleman has explained, these two very cumbersome and complex Statutory Instruments represent rationalisation of that which went before. "Rationalisation" is a word much in favour with hon. Members opposite, and it is as well for them to bear in mind, when they apply it to other things, the complications that can flow from any attempt to rationalise even such a small matter as this.

One or two questions occur to me when comparing the two schemes. The answers may well lie in the fact that the schemes have different historical origins, but it will be useful to the House to have a precise explanation. First of all, both schemes provide—one in Regulation 14 and the other in Regulation 15—that the decision of the board shall be final. Are we to take it that that excludes, as I think it must, any right of appeal in the ordinary way from the decision of the board to the courts, or any other independent body?

The second question really flows from the first. It is odd, if the right of appeal in general is so excluded, to find express provision in Regulation 15 of the pneumoconiosis scheme for a limited right of appeal on the one point dealt with in that regulation. The hon. Gentleman will recollect that that regulation provides for the board to have a right to refer to an insurance officer certain questions if it is of the opinion that they arise.

It goes on to provide that where the insurance officer decides those questions there shall be the ordinary right of appeal in accordance with the Industrial Injuries Act. It seems odd that that limited right of appeal should be preserved under one scheme and not on the other on that one point but not apparently on anything else. Am I right in thinking that there is in general no right of appeal in either of these schemes?

Why is there the discrepancy between the two schemes as between Regulation 21 of the pneumoconiosis scheme and Regulation 19 of the workmen's compensation scheme? Regulation 21 makes special provision in sub-paragraph (2) for death benefits, but the corresponding regulation for the workmen's compensation scheme makes no provision for death benefit. There may be a perfectly good reason for this, but it does not strike one at first sight. Perhaps the most important point is that in both regulations it is provided that, in general, no allowances shall be paid for a period of more than six months before the date on which the claim is made. I take it that it means there will be no retrospective payment of allowances and people brought into these schemes for the first time will be entitled to only six months' back benefit.

I take it that that is the general intention and I quite understand why, but what I am not clear about is what the limits are to the discretion of the board and the administrative board under these regulations. Under both it is provided that in any particular case the board may determine that the allowance shall be payable from some earlier date. No specific limit is drawn to that discretion to give retrospective allowances. The death benefit provision is on quite specific grounds. It is provided that the board may give back payment when there is reasonable cause for failure to make payment earlier.

I am a little concerned with the words giving the board the right to determine as they may lead to a wide-ranging and not necessarily consistent discretion being exercised. It will be difficult when a man requires back payment and says, "You have the right to determine that my back payment should be more than six months. Why do you not take account of my hardship and make payment for longer than six months?". I am a little disturbed that there is no guidance given to the board under that provision.

If I read the schemes aright, I am glad to see that they both take account of the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for Wokingham, who expressed the hope that no one would be penalised by the changes being made and no one would be worse off now than before the Act was passed. That seems to have been achieved. I should like to know, however, whether the provisions of the schemes have been considered, or are to be considered, by the Council on Tribunals before the regulations and schemes are brought before the House. My understanding of the procedure since the Tribunals and Inquiries Act was passed is that any administrative or quasi-administrative body of this kind has to have its procedure and establishment approved by the Council. I should like to know whether this procedure has been thoroughly approved in that way by the Council.

During the Second Reading of the Bill under which these schemes are made my hon. Friend the Member for Sutton and Cheam (Mr. Sharpies) drew the attention of the Government to the necessity for giving the utmost possible publicity to these schemes and the changes so that all the 27,000 potentially affected should know about them. My hon. Friend made the point expressly that it must not be assumed that all of these people, some of them unemployed now for some years, are necessarily in close contact with their trade union organisations and thus able to learn about it on the industrial grapevine. The Parliamentary Secretary said that revised leaflets would be prepared setting out the pattern of the scheme. I hope that this debate in itself will have served to give additional publicity to the fact that these changes are being made with the approval of both sides of the House.

I should like to have the Parliamentary Secretary's assurance that some more specific attempt will be made to publicise these measures as widely as possible so that no one who is entitled to these benefits will go without them through ignorance of what has been done.