Orders of the Day — Merchant Shipping (Safety Convention) Bill

Part of the debate – in the House of Commons at 12:00 am on 30 March 1949.

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Photo of Hon. John Maclay Hon. John Maclay , Montrose District of Burghs 12:00, 30 March 1949

I must thank the hon. Member for Rutherglen (Mr. McAllister) for the kind remarks he made about my family and myself in connection with shipping in Scotland. If I may touch on a personal note which he has started, it is to me a rather remarkable thing that my father, who is in his 92nd year, has seen the whole progress of the British Mercantile Marine from the days of sailing vessels, and he is extremely interested in this latest development with regard to the safety of ships.

As the hon. Member for Hereford (Mr. J. P. L. Thomas) said, it is remarkable to find twice in one year the same Minister coming to this House with a Bill which gets universal approval. That, I believe, is a unique record for any Minister of this Government. Perhaps we might well look for the reason for it in the personality and general conduct of the Minister, but I must not go too far or I might find myself qualifying for the Transport Commission. I think that we have to watch the Minister of Transport very carefully. He has a most persuasive way which conceals a relentless purpose when he knows what he wants and is determined to get it. Today we need not worry about that aspect of the Minister because we are all in agreement with the object of this Bill which he has brought before us.

There is another reason why both the Bills which the Minister has brought before the House in the last year have received universal approval, and it is the obvious one that they both deal with shipping. The first dealt with the conditions of life on board, and this one deals with the conditions and safety of ships. Throughout our history as a nation, where anything to do with the Merchant Navy has been involved, the nation has worked as one with the minimum controversy. We have had a remarkable record of labour relations in the shipping industry for a great many years. Conditions, on the other hand, have not been everything that could be expected in the past. It takes time to bring ships, of all things up to date. We cannot do it overnight, and I think that there has been great restraint and understanding on the part of all concerned in the relationship between employers and seamen. The National Maritime Board is a classic example of joint consultation on conditions of service between employers and employees.

The Bill, of course, implements a Convention which is a remarkable achievement in its own way, and without going over the ground already covered, I think it is worth rubbing in that the Conference was attended by no fewer than 30 nations with full delegations and by three or four observing nations. There were seven weeks of highly technical discussions, and a number of controversial points came up which were bound to arise. Some nations had certain enthusiasms, but it is a remarkable tribute to all those negotiating that agreement was reached in the end on a document which was not signed by the 30 nations but by 28, with the orthodox and proper abstention of Russia and Yugoslavia. I hope that in spite of that abstention, those nations will be inspired by the unanimity of the other nations, and that some good results may come. I hope that their ships will not fail to conform to the standards of safety laid down by the Conference and by this Convention.

I think that it is worth while pointing out the actual composition of the British delegation. Some hon. Members opposite seem to have the fear that the representation of the sea-going officers and men was not adequate, and that there was more representation of shipowners and shipbuilders. I do not think that numerically that is so. The actual delegation was a most remarkable mixture of talent. The Minister of Transport was there, and representatives of the Admiralty, the Foreign Office, the Air Ministry, the Ministry of Civil Aviation, the Post Office, the Meteorological Office, Trinity House, the great classification societies, the organisations representing the sea-going officers and men and, last but not least, the shipbuilders and shipowners. That was a remarkable team to get together and to work together. Not only had we this very large number of delegates but a number of expert advisers.

I have brought this in for two purposes. There is no doubt, from everything that I have been told about this Conference, that the British delegation did distinguish itself quite remarkably. I have met foreign shipowners who attended, and they were full of praise for the way that the British delegation worked, and the organisation put into the Conference in advance, which did tremendous credit to all concerned. Tributes have already been paid today to the right hon. Member for the Scottish Universities (Sir J. Anderson), in which we must join. Tribute must also be paid to some of the senior officials of the Ministry of Transport on whom fell the heavy load of organisation and keeping the whole Conference going. I think it is only right that we should depart from the Parliamentary practice of never saying anything about civil servants except to be rude about them, and say that on this occasion we can do nothing but give them the highest praise.

Another thing remarkable about the Convention and the Bill, which may be because of the excellent preparatory work done, is that they are models of clarity. One can read this Bill and know what it is trying to do. That is a very remarkable achievement in these days. The Minister has got over certain difficulties by not annexing the Convention to the Bill. He has published the Convention as a separate White Paper. Had he had to work it into the Bill, there might have been real trouble. The Bill is understandable, and if one studies the Convention, apart from those sections of it which only highly technical experts could possibly understand, the Convention is also a model for that kind of international conference. It is better than the earlier one which it replaces. It has tidied up the lay-out of the Convention, making the articles at the beginning quite clear-cut and laying down basic intergovernmental procedure; and then come the regulations dealing with the technical matters.

I do not propose to go into details about the Bill or the Convention. Many points have been covered in the course of this Debate, and if we started on any of the details of the Convention or the Bill we should be talking for hours, and I do not think to any great advantage.

I mention one particular point at this stage because it was touched on by hon. Members opposite. That is Article 9 which requires a two-thirds majority of the participating nations to amend the Convention. It is important that in an international convention of this kind, which has very great implications on the design, structure and lay-out of ships, it should not be too easy to amend it year by year. Hon. Members opposite take another line on that. They say that as soon as there is any new practice available it should be incorporated, if necessary by law, in any new ships that come out and possibly also in existing ships. When we get down to the kind of matter dealt with by this Convention, it is better to get reasonable stability and make certain that there will not be too much chopping and changing. That safeguard is given by the central committee of the Inter-Governmental Maritime Consultative Organisation, which is watching this thing, and if there is some new development which emerges which it is very desirable to incorporate into shipping practice, then it can come up for consideration, and with a two-thirds majority we can get that new development incorporated. I think that is a sensible safeguard.

There is a danger in anything to do with the safety of ships. Seafaring people do not forget that the sea is a hard master and tests out very carefully indeed all the things done to it. When a ship of new design goes to sea, the best and most skilful calculations may all be proved quite wrong, owing to the quite unpredictable things that one meets at sea. It therefore behoves people to move fairly carefully and slowly in trying new safety devices and new techniques for subdivision or anything like that. The old devices which we have got and the structure that has been developed, have been developed over a long period, and one wants to move very carefully in trying any thing radical and new. The Convention is very sound in its provision for revision.

There is one other point about the Convention worth mentioning, and that concerns the grain carriage regulations. It is undoubtedly excellent that at long last there is to be a uniform standard of fitting for the carriage of grain in deep-sea ships. One small question on this concerns the fines imposed if a ship, whether British or foreign, arrives in a British port with its equipment, the grain feeders, and so on, not in accordance with the regulations.