Part of Orders of the Day — National Service Bill. – in the House of Commons at on 10 December 1941.
Mr Rhys Davies
, Westhoughton
Under this Measure women will be conscripted for the Auxiliary Fighting Forces and for industry as well. We are told, of course, that none of them will be called upon to use lethal weapons unless they express a desire to do so. I would like to warn the Committee about what happens here from time to time. It is one of the curious habits of this House of Commons that first of all the Governments ask for volunteers—as in the Home Guard—and when they have volunteered compulsion begins to be enforced. I venture to say that if the Committee agrees to bring women in touch with the Armed Forces and if this war lasts very much longer, compulsion will ultimately be used and women will be found right in the trenches in due course. That is where we are going in connection with this Measure.
This Bill, of course, means industrial conscription. The right hon. Gentleman made a promise once that he would never introduce industrial conscription in this country. I am sure of one thing: if the people of this country want to conduct this war to a final issue, as is suggested here, they will fight it very much more effectively as volunteers than as conscripts, and I have reason to say that because I have had experience of the right hon. Gentleman's handling of labour problems since this war began. First of all, he said to ex-miners, "I want you to register, because we want you back in the pits." They registered, and after registration he directed them back to the pits. There are scores of men in my Division who believe to-day that they have two enemies in this world—Hitler and the right hon. Gentleman. [Interruption.]—It is no use interrupting; compulsion is all right until it comes down to you personally. Some of these ex-miners had been out of the pits for years, now working in other industries for £8 or £10 a week, and the right hon. Gentleman instructs them to go back to the pits at £3 5s. a week. Try that on yourselves, you who laugh at my remarks. Then— and I speak with some feeling—if they will not return to work in the pits, the right hon. Gentleman sends some of them to gaol. When we pass this Measure, if the women will not carry out his directions, I think we shall find that there will be provision to send the women too to goal. I therefore want to say that I object to this Bill, especially as it relates to women.
Now, I come to the main argument that I want to put against conscripting women. I happen to have been for the last 36 years connected with the administration of sickness, maternity, disablement and kindred benefits, and it is my job to try and study the course of events statistically and socially in this country. There is an old saying that the politician usually looks forward to the next General Election and that the statesman looks to the next generation. Let me ask the House to follow me to the crux of the problem as I see it. This Bill has as its background what I shall call the population problem. Our country is faced at last with what are termed the vital and inexorable facts of population. Where do we stand? In 1870 the birth-rate was 35 per 1,000 of the population, in 1890 it had declined to 30, in 1920 it had been reduced further to 22 and in 1940 it was only about 15 per 1,000.
We have established clinics and welfare centres, and we pay maternity benefit too. All those social services have been established in order to induce an increase in population. An hon. Member says "No," and I will accept it therefore that we have done all that to keep alive those who are born. I should have thought the House of Commons would have regard to what is the first essential of our civilisation, the birth-rate, but here we are today talking of conscripting the mothers of the future. Unless I am mistaken, the more we document, ticket, dragoon, drill and compel the mothers of the future, the lower still will fall the birth-rate. I feel almost sure of that. I am as British, I suppose, as anybody here—more British than the English, because we Welsh arrived here first.
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