Orders of the Day — Government of India Bill. – in the House of Commons at on 27 March 1935.
Duchess of ATHOLL:
I beg to move, in page 67, line 7, after "Family," to insert "or the Succession to the Crown."
I do not know how far this question may be held to have been covered by the discussion on Clause 108, but in any case I do not think I need say very much in moving this Amendment. Clause 110 as printed would prevent the Federal Legislature or any Provincial Legislature making any law affecting the Sovereign or the Royal Family, and my Amendment is to include also the succession to the Crown. It is only to make what must obviously be the intention of the Government perfectly clear.
Mr Thomas Inskip
, Fareham
My Noble Friend is right in saying that it is the Government's intention that there should be no power to affect the succession to the Throne, and I am not at all sure that her words are not preferable to the form of the Clause as it stands. I trust she will allow us to consider further the proper form of drafting the Clause, so as to cover the point that we both have in view.
Mr Gordon Macdonald
, Ince
I beg to move, in page 67, line 12, to leave out from "courts" to the end of the Clause.
The Indian Legislature, we think, ought to have the power to amend themselves in the direction they themselves desire. As the Clause stands, paragraph (ii) does not give them the power we think they should have, and our sole purpose is to enable them, if and when they think necessary, to amend their own constitution.
Mr R.A. Butler
, Saffron Walden
We have had a discussion on this subject before this evening, but I think I ought to give some short reply to the hon. Member. He would give the Indian Legislature the power of amending this particular Constitution Act. I am afraid the Government cannot accept this Amendment. As a result of discussions in the Joint Select Committee, certain power was given for representations to be made from the Indian Legislature, and we were very glad to insert that provision, because it gave the Indian Legislature the opportunity of voicing their opinions on this particular Measure. The whole of the machinery in connection with these representations is set out in Clause 285, and if the hon. Member will turn to that rather long Clause, he will see that there is there an opportunity for representations to be made by the Indian Legislature. But apart from that, I am afraid it is not the intention, as appears clearly from the Clause, that there should be an opportunity of amending this Constitution Act in the way that the hon. Member desires. I therefore regret that we are unable to accept the Amendment.
Mr Clement Attlee
, Stepney Limehouse
This Amendment is designed to raise the question of constituent powers. I do not suppose that the Amendment would effect exactly what we want, but it is difficult to get anything in the four corners of the Bill that would do anything that we want when we have got as far as this. We have always taken the line that there should be a power of development in this Bill, that there should be a progressive increase of responsibility. At the present moment the whole tendency is to tie it down more and more closely. The discussion we have had to-day was mainly in the line of trying to restrict anything in the way of development. I am aware of the suggestion of Mr. Jayakar to the Joint Select Committee, but it is only a suggestion that in certain circumstances, after a certain period, an Indian Legislature could make representations to this House. It is a rather far off and extremely thin suggestion. We consider that there should be in this Bill some constituent powers because, once we pass this Clause, we have practically got rid of the whole question of constituent powers, and we may be ruled out if we want to raise it in other forms later on. I am aware of all the difficulties. There are parts of this Bill which I would not like to see left entirely to the power of Indians. We would not be prepared to say that the people in India should be disfranchised by power given under this Bill, but we do not want to see the whole question of constituent powers set on one side. For that reason, we move the Amendment.
| Division No. 123.] | AYES. | [8.30 p.m. |
| Acland-Troyte, Lieut-Colonel | Boulton, W. W. | Chapman, Sir Samuel (Edinburgh, S.) |
| Albery, Irving James | Bower, Commander Robert Tatton | Chorlton, Alan Ernest Leofric |
| Allen, Sir J. Sandeman (L'pool, W.) | Bowyer, Capt. Sir George E. W. | Christie, James Archibald |
| Allen, Lt.-Col. J. Sandeman (B'k'nh'd) | Boyd-Carpenter, Sir Archibald | Clayton, Sir Christopher |
| Apsley, Lord | Bracken, Brendan | Colfox, Major William Philip |
| Aske, Sir Robert William | Briscoe, Capt. Richard George | Cook, Thomas A. |
| Baldwin-Webb. Colonel J. | Broadbent, Colonel John | Cooke, Douglas |
| Balfour, George (Hampstead) | Brown, Col. D. C. (N'th'I'd., Hexham) | Courthope, Colonel Sir George L. |
| Balfour, Capt. Harold (I. of Thanet) | Browne, Captain A. C. | Craddock, Sir Reginald Henry |
| Beauchamp, Sir Brograve Campbell | Buchan-Hepburn, P. G. T. | Croft, Brigadier-General Sir H. |
| Belt, Sir Alfred L. | Butler, Richard Austen | Crooke, J. Smedley |
| Benn, Sir Arthur Shirley | Cadogan, Hon. Edward | Crookshank, Col. C. de Windt (Bootle) |
| Bennett, Capt. Sir Ernest Nathaniel | Campbell-Johnston, Malcolm | Crookshank, Capt. H. C. (Gainsb'ro) |
| Bernays, Robert | Caporn, Arthur Cecil | Davison, Sir William Henry |
| Bird, Sir Robert B.(Wolverh'pton W.) | Carver, Major William H. | Denman, Hon. R. D. |
| Bossom, A. C. | Cazalet, Thelma (Islington, E.) | Duggan, Hubert John |
| Duncan, James A. L. (Kensington, N.) | Loder, Captin J. de Vers | Rhys, Hon. Charles Arthur U. |
| Ellis, Sir R. Geoffrey | Loftus, Pierce C. | Rickards, George William |
| Emmott, Charles E. G. C. | Lumtey, Captain Lawrence R. | Roberts, Sir Samuel (Ecclesall) |
| Entwistle, Cyril Fuilard | Mac Andrew, Lieut,-Col. C. G.(Partick) | Ross Taylor, Walter (Woodbridge) |
| Erskino-Bolst, Capt. C. C. (Blackpool) | Mac Andrew, Capt. J. O. (Ayr) | Salt, Edward W. |
| Essenhigh, Reginald Clare | MacDonald, Malcolm (Bassetlaw) | Samuel, Rt. Hon. Sir H. (Darwen) |
| Evans, R. T. (Carmarthen) | McEwen, Captain J. H. F. | Savery, Samuel Servington |
| Foot, Isaac (Cornwall, Bodmin) | McLean, Major Sir Alan | Shaw, Helen a. (Lanark, Bothwell) |
| Fremantle, Sir Francis | McLean, Dr. W. H. (Tradeston) | Shaw, Captain William T. (Forfar) |
| Fuller, Captain A. G. | Magnay, Thomas | Shepperson, Sir Ernest W. |
| Gillett, Sir George Masterman | Makins, Brigadier-General Ernest | Smith, Louis W. (Sheffield, Hallam) |
| Glossop, C. W. H | Mander, Geoffrey le M. | Somervell, Sir Donald |
| Griffith, F. Kingsley (Middlesbro', W.) | Manningham-Buller, Lt.-Col. Sir M. | Somcrville. D. G. (Willesden, East) |
| Quest, Capt. Rt. Hon. F. E. | Margesson, Capt. Rt. Hon. H. D. R. | Sotheron Estcourt, Captain T. E. |
| Guinness, Thomas L. E. B. | Mayhew, Lieut.-Colonel John | Spencer, Captain Richard A. |
| Gunston, Captain D. W. | Melier, Sir Richard James | Spens, William Patrick |
| Hamilton, Sir R. W. (Orkney & Zetl'nd) | Mitchell, Harold P. (Br'tf'd & Chisw'k) | Stanley, Rt. Hon. Lord (Fylde) |
| Hanbury, Cecil | Molson, A. Hugh Elidale | Stanley, Rt. Hon. Oliver (W'morland) |
| Hannon, Patrick Joseph Henry | Monsell, Rt. Hon. Sir B. Eyres | Steel-Maltland, Rt. Hon. Sir Arthur |
| Harvey, Major Sir Samuel (Totnes) | Moreing, Adrian C. | Stevenson, James |
| Haslam, Henry (Horncastle) | Morris-Jones, Dr. J. H. (Denbigh) | Stones, James |
| Haslam, Sir John (Bolton) | Morrison, G. A. (Scottish Univer'ties) | Strauss, Edward A. |
| Hellgers, Captain F. F. A. | Morrison, William Shepherd | Thomas, James P. L. (Herelord) |
| Henderson, Sir Vivian L. (Chelmsford) | Moss, Captain H. J. | Thomson, Sir Frederick Charles |
| Herbert, Capt. S. (Abbey Division) | Nation, Brigadier-General J. J. H. | Titchfield, Major the Marquess of |
| Hills, Major Rt. Hon. John Waller | Nicholson, Godfrey (Morpeth) | Todd, Lt.-Col. A. J. K. (B'wick-on-T.) |
| Holdsworth, Herbert | O'Donovan, Dr. William James | Todd, A. L. S. (Kingswinford) |
| Hornby, Frank | O'Neill, Rt. Hon. Sir Hugh | Turton, Robert Hugh |
| Horsbrugh, Florence | Ormsby-Gore, Rt. Hn. William G. A. | Wallace, Captain D. E. (Hornsey) |
| Hunter-Weston, Lt.-Gen. Sir Aylmer | Patrick, Colin M. | Ward, Sarah Adelaide (Cannock) |
| Inskip, Rt. Hon. Sir Thomas W. H. | Peat, Charles U. | Wardlaw-Milne, Sir John S. |
| James, Wing-Corn. A. W. H. | Penny, Sir George | Warrender, Sir Victor A. G. |
| Jamieson, Douglas | Perkins, Walter R. D. | Waterhouse, Captain Charles |
| Jones, Henry Haydn (Merioneth) | Pickthorn, K. W. M. | Wayland, Sir William A. |
| Jones, Lewis (Swansea, West) | Powell, Lieut. Col. Evelyn G. H. | Wedderburn, Henry James Scrymgeour |
| Ker, J. Campbell | Pownall, Sir Assheton | Wells, Sydney Richard |
| Kirkpatrick, William M. | Radford, E. A. | Williams, Herbert G. (Croydon, S.) |
| Lamb, Sir Joseph Quinton | Raikes, Henry V. A. M. | Wilson, Clyde T. (West Toxteth) |
| Law, Richard K. (Hull, S. W.) | Ramsay, Alexander (W. Bromwich) | Wamersley, Sir Walter |
| Leech, Dr. J. W. | Ramsay, T. B. W. (Western Isles) | Worthington, Dr. John V. |
| Lees-Jones, John | Ramsbotham, Herwald | Young, Ernest J. (Middlesbrough, E.) |
| Lennox-Boyd, A. T. | Ramsden, Sir Eugene | |
| Lewis, Oswald | Reed, Arthur C. (Exeter) | TELLERS FOR THE AYES.— |
| Liddall, Walter S. | Reld, William Allan (Derby) | Lieut.-Colonel Sir A. Lambert Ward |
| and Major George Davies. | ||
| NOES. | ||
| Attlee, Clement Richard | Hall, George H. (Merthyr Tydvil) | Smith, Tom (Normanton) |
| Brown, C. W. E. (Notts., Mansfield) | Hicks, Ernest George | Thorne, William James |
| Buchanan, George | Jenkins, Sir William | Tinker, John Joseph |
| Cripps, Sir Stafford | John, William | Williams, David (Swansea, East) |
| Daggar, George | Leonard, William | Williams, Thomas (York, Don Valley) |
| Davies, Rhys John (Westhoughton) | Lunn, William | Wilmot, John |
| Dobbie, William | Macdonald. Gordon (Ince) | |
| Gardner, Benjamin Walter | McEntee, Valentine L. | TELLERS FOR THE NOES.— |
| Greenwood, Rt. Hon. Arthur | Paling, Wilfred | Mr. D. Graham and Mr. Groves. |
| Grundy, Thomas W. | Parkinson. John Allen |
Bill read the Third time, and passed.
A parliamentary bill is divided into sections called clauses.
Printed in the margin next to each clause is a brief explanatory `side-note' giving details of what the effect of the clause will be.
During the committee stage of a bill, MPs examine these clauses in detail and may introduce new clauses of their own or table amendments to the existing clauses.
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The House of Commons votes by dividing. Those voting Aye (yes) to any proposition walk through the division lobby to the right of the Speaker and those voting no through the lobby to the left. In each of the lobbies there are desks occupied by Clerks who tick Members' names off division lists as they pass through. Then at the exit doors the Members are counted by two Members acting as tellers. The Speaker calls for a vote by announcing "Clear the Lobbies". In the House of Lords "Clear the Bar" is called. Division Bells ring throughout the building and the police direct all Strangers to leave the vicinity of the Members’ Lobby. They also walk through the public rooms of the House shouting "division". MPs have eight minutes to get to the Division Lobby before the doors are closed. Members make their way to the Chamber, where Whips are on hand to remind the uncertain which way, if any, their party is voting. Meanwhile the Clerks who will take the names of those voting have taken their place at the high tables with the alphabetical lists of MPs' names on which ticks are made to record the vote. When the tellers are ready the counting process begins - the recording of names by the Clerk and the counting of heads by the tellers. When both lobbies have been counted and the figures entered on a card this is given to the Speaker who reads the figures and announces "So the Ayes [or Noes] have it". In the House of Lords the process is the same except that the Lobbies are called the Contents Lobby and the Not Contents Lobby. Unlike many other legislatures, the House of Commons and the House of Lords have not adopted a mechanical or electronic means of voting. This was considered in 1998 but rejected. Divisions rarely take less than ten minutes and those where most Members are voting usually take about fifteen. Further information can be obtained from factsheet P9 at the UK Parliament site.
