Debate on the Address

Part of the debate – in the House of Commons at 12:00 am on 21 April 1966.

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Photo of Mr Robert Maxwell Mr Robert Maxwell , Buckingham 12:00, 21 April 1966

I do not propose to go over the points made by the hon. Member for Portsmouth, Langstone (Mr. Ian Lloyd) except to say that the views which he and some of his friends take on the issue of Rhodesia are tantamount to supporting treason. This is quite extraordinary, having regard to the fact that they must know that if we were to abdicate responsibility over Rhodesia Mr. Smith and his régime would not be allowed to survive. They would fall into far worse hands and to far bigger enemies—to people who might bring about a conflagration in the African continent, and possibly a war between the races. These are not issues over which we should bandy words and say that we should let things take their natural course.

I wish to deal with that part of the Gracious Speech relating to the Government's promise to reintroduce the Prices and Incomes Bill, this time preserving the vital voluntary principle on which negotiations between trade unions and employers have been built up over almost a century. This is undoubtedly a change on the previous Bill on this subject, and I welcome it. But if the Government introduce a Bill accepting the voluntary principle success can be achieved only by striking a bargain with the trade unions to accept a new and important principle for themselves, namely, that they also have a responsibility for productivity. Until now, the trade union negotiators have said that they are paid by their members in order to ensure that their members receive maximum wages, and to ensure that conditions of employment are improved. When management speaks to the trade unions about productivity, the trade unions say that this is the responsibility of management. In the past that attitude of the trade unions was quite understandable, because all along they have feared, and still fear, a return to unemployment.

The Labour Government have pledged themselves to maintain full employment. In spite of the fact that we have suffered and are still suffering a severe economic crisis, we have managed to maintain full employment. As a Government, we have introduced the Redundancy Payments Act, and retraining, and for all these reasons the Government can rightly ask of the trade unions that they should now accept the responsibility also for bringing about an increase in productivity.

If they will accept this, perhaps the best way to proceed is that wage negotiations should be conducted on a national basis only for minimum national scales and that any additional increases should be achieved by negotiations on a plant-to-plant basis. The unions would have on their staff paid officials who would be concerned with advising their members and the employers how to bring about increases in productivity. Where, on a plant-negotiating basis, one can bring about savings in manpower or increases in productivity, the share out between the workers and the plant might be on the basis of a third for increased wages, another third put into a fund for modernising the plant or buying new equipment, and the other third to the shareholders.

The Conservative Party's proposal to deal with this matter—the unions to accept the responsibility for productivity, avoid disputes and unofficial strikes—by introducing legislation which would fine members of unions who go out on unofficial strikes, will not do. Our gaols would not be big enough. This type of legislation has been tried in Australia and it is in effect in the United States. Its net result in both countries is that they, unlike us, have far more strikes, both official and unofficial, per million man hours or days or shifts worked—whatever statistics are taken. Legislation of the type which the Conservative Party wants to introduce has failed in Australia and the United States and it would be bound to fail in this country.

I am certain that the way in which our Administration proposes to tackle this—by getting, the trade unions to co-operate on a voluntary basis, by persuading them that they have a responsibility for bringing about an increase in productivity—is a better way of doing things than that which the Opposition have in mind. While we have an urgent need to increase productivity and while these negotiations and talks with the trade unions and management are bound to last several months, I wonder whether the Chancellor of the Exchequer—I know that he is in a very tight situation over his Budget—could look at the possibility of bringing in legislation about overtime earnings to give for a period in those industries which are short of labour, or where export orders are held up some tax incentives or advantage. This may be the only way in which these orders can be fulfilled and in which these industries could attract the extra amount of productivity and time. I put this forward as a suggestion for my right hon. Friend to consider.

I am disappointed not to find in the Gracious Speech steps that the Government propose to take to limit imports and to persuade British industry and the consumer not to buy foreign goods and services on the kind of scale which we are doing. Whether we like it or not, we shall have to give up the import surcharge. I fear that, once that is done, there will be an even greater flood of imports into the country.

I suggest that the Government should set up a committee with the same kind of powers and purposes as the National Export Council. This committee's business and function would be to encourage British industry and to encourage the consumers to buy British, instead of relying, as we appear to be on a very large scale, on imports which are often of an inferior kind and which we can hardly afford.

It is seldom that I agree with the Leader of the Opposition, but I must admit that the wording in the Gracious Speech about science is rather fatuous: The development of science will be continued. That is a remarkable statement. I have a great deal to do with scientists and I know that they will be tremendously disappointed that this is all that the Government propose to do for science and for this to be put in this fatuous form.

I am afraid that our present set-up for the organisation of science and technology leaves a great deal to be desired. There is a number of problems and opportunities which have become visible in recent years which yield neither to the traditional approaches nor to the efforts of established organisations, either at the Ministry or of Technology or any other which we have.

These include the obsolescence of the public systems on which our well-being depends—for instance, transportation in our great conurbations, urban design and services, crime prevention and control, public health, water resources, waste and pollution control; our increasing dependence on the social, economic and political development of other countries; the opportunity for our educational institutions to prepare people for adaptive and creative contributions to the modern world; and the opportunity for organisations, including universities, Government agencies and business firms, to develop management skills adequate to respond adaptively to the problems which confront us.

These problems and opportunities require technological innovation. They require social change and renewal in interpersonal, organisational and political areas. These problems and opportunities require not only studies and analyses, whose product is reports, but the commitment to long-term work on the process of bringing ideas to reality. Only through direct participation in these processes can we gain new insights and develop new skilled resources.

There are first-rate people with skills in social and technical innovation in groups of varying sizes scattered throughout the country. I should like to see the Government—perhaps the Ministry of Technology—bring them together in larger and more effective groups, so that we can tackle these problems in an effective form. To give an example, we still do not have a technique or a method to get the facts on which a Minister could base his decision as to when a particular research laboratory or even a Ministry has come to the end of its useful life or the end of its mission. What use does one then make of the manpower and the machines? What task can one set these people to do? We have not begun to understand or to plan these things, and I should like to see, through the Ministry of Technology, a considerable increase in support of research and development by a group of people who could do this type of work.

I am glad that the Government are to continue to give the highest priority to maintaining the parity of sterling and to increasing exports. It is amusing to note that in this debate the speeches from the Leader of the Opposition and other hon. Members opposite have been made as if they were still carrying on the General Election whereas hon. Members on this side of the House have been concerning themselves with the issues which matter.