Schedule 8 - Consequential and minor amendments

Public Service Pensions Bill – in a Public Bill Committee at 3:30 pm on 20 November 2012.

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Photo of Sajid Javid Sajid Javid The Economic Secretary to the Treasury 3:30, 20 November 2012

I beg to move amendment 31, in schedule 8, page 44, line 36, at end insert—

20C A pension payable under a scheme made by the Scottish Ministers under section1 of the Public Service Pensions Act 2013 by virtue of section1(2)(d) of that Act (teachers).”’.

Photo of Annette Brooke Annette Brooke Liberal Democrat, Mid Dorset and North Poole

With this it will be convenient to discuss Government amendments 32 to 38.

Photo of Sajid Javid Sajid Javid The Economic Secretary to the Treasury

The amendments make several refinements to the consequential changes that the Bill makes to schedule 2 to the Pensions (Increase) Act 1971 and its equivalent for Northern Ireland, which provide for the annual uprating of public service pensions. The changes apply to deferred pensions and pensions in payment. The amendments also make some technical changes to ensure that the powers under the 1971 Act are used only in the way they are intended.

The amendments will ensure that the schemes made under the Bill by the devolved authorities are listed in the correct places in schedule 2 to the 1971 Act. They build on, and clarify, the changes already proposed in schedule 8, and they do not extend them further, or introduce anything new.

The amendments will ensure that increases in benefits that are made under the 1971 Act or its equivalent in Northern Ireland will apply only to defined benefit pension schemes made under the Bill. It would not be appropriate for the 1971 Act to increase other schemes that might be made under the Bill, such as defined contribution pension schemes, and the amendments will make sure that that does not happen.

Photo of Cathy Jamieson Cathy Jamieson Shadow Minister (Treasury)

The Minister gave us a clear outline of what the Government amendments are intended to do. It is always good to see tidying-up amendments tabled to make sure that everything is, indeed, in its correct place.

As the Minister said, amendments 31 and 32 amend the Pensions (Increase) Act 1971 to refer to the Bill. Amendments 33 to 36 replace references to legislation relating to Wales and Scotland and references to the 1971 Act with references to the relevant parts of the Bill. Amendments 37 and 38 replace references to Northern Ireland with references to the relevant parts of the Bill. Amendments 41 and 42—crucially, I would imagine, for the people affected—make minor changes to payments from the general lighthouse fund under the Merchant Shipping Act 1995.

I like to pick up, at every opportunity, on changes made in relation to Scotland, and it is worth noting that the “skedule” or schedule—my hon. Friend the Member for Nottingham East and I have different accents—makes changes to the Sheriffs’ Pensions (Scotland) Act 1961, which is important for a number of members of the judiciary in Scotland. I say that as a former Justice Minister there, and I am sure that members of the judiciary in Scotland will want to see that I am still on the case and looking after their interests, even though I have moved on from the Scottish Parliament to this place. That aside, the Opposition do not object to the amendments.

Amendment 31 agreed to.

Amendments made: 32, in schedule 8, page 44, line 41, at end insert—

22B A pension payable under a scheme made by the Scottish Ministers under section1 of the Public Service Pensions Act 2013 by virtue of section 1(2)(e) of that Act (health service workers).”’.

Amendment 33, in schedule 8, page 45, leave out lines 6 to 21.

Amendment 34, in schedule 8, page 45, leave out lines 23 to 25 and insert—

39A A pension payable under a defined benefits scheme, within the meaning of the Public Service Pensions Act 2013, made by the Secretary of State or the Scottish Ministers under section1 of that Act by virtue of section 1(2)(c) of that Act (local government workers).”’.

Amendment 35, in schedule 8, page 45, leave out lines 27 to 30 and insert—

43A A pension payable under a defined benefits scheme, within the meaning of the Public Service Pensions Act 2013, made by the Secretary of State or Scottish Ministers under section1 of that Act by virtue of section 1(2)(g) of that Act (police).

44 In the case of a scheme made by the Secretary of State, this paragraph does include a pension referred to in paragraph 15B above.”’.

Amendment 36, in schedule 8, page 45, leave out lines 32 to 35 and insert—

44A A pension payable under a defined benefits scheme, within the meaning of the Public Service Pensions Act 2013, made by the Secretary of State, Scottish Ministers or Welsh Ministers under section1 of that Act by virtue of section 1(2)(f) of that Act (fire and rescue workers).

44B In the case of a scheme made by the Secretary of State, this paragraph does not include a pension referred to in paragraph 16B above.”’.

Amendment 37, in schedule 8, page 46, leave out lines 25 to 28 and insert—

14B A pension payable under a defined benefits scheme, within the meaning of the Public Service Pensions Act 2013, made by a Northern Ireland department under section1 of that Act by virtue of section 1(2)(c) of that Act (local government workers).”’.

Amendment 38, in schedule 8, page 46, leave out lines 30 to 33 and insert—

16A A pension payable under a defined benefits scheme, within the meaning of the Public Service Pensions Act 2013, made by a Northern Ireland department under section1 of that Act by virtue of section 1(2)(f) of that Act (fire and rescue workers).”’.

Amendment 39, in schedule 8, page 48, leave out lines 30 to 33 and insert—

‘“(fb) a committee of a relevant authority which is the scheme manager (or scheme manager and pension board) of a scheme under section1 of the Public Service Pensions Act 2013;”.’.—(Sajid Javid.)

Photo of Sajid Javid Sajid Javid The Economic Secretary to the Treasury

I beg to move amendment 40, in schedule 8, page 49, line 42, at end insert—

‘Merchant Shipping Act 1995 (c. 21)

29A (1) Section 214 of the Merchant Shipping Act 1995 (pension rights of persons whose salaries are paid out of the General Lighthouse Fund) is amended as follows.

(2) The existing provision is numbered as subsection (1).

(3) After that subsection there is inserted—

“(2) Where pensions, allowances and gratuities to or in respect of persons whose salaries are paid out of the General Lighthouse Fund are payable otherwise than under subsection (1), sums in respect of those benefits may with the approval of the Secretary of State be paid out of that Fund.”’.

Photo of Annette Brooke Annette Brooke Liberal Democrat, Mid Dorset and North Poole

With this it will be convenient to discuss Government amendment 41.

Photo of Sajid Javid Sajid Javid The Economic Secretary to the Treasury

Amendment 40 amends schedule 8 to allow a consequential amendment to the Merchant Shipping Act 1995. It is the Government’s intention that the smaller pension schemes run by various public bodies be closed or reformed along the lines of the reforms to the major schemes and, in the former case, that their members be brought into one of the main public service pension schemes. The pension schemes run by the three general lighthouse authorities are examples of such schemes.

Pensions paid to the employees of these authorities are currently paid out of the general lighthouse fund established under the Merchant Shipping Act 1995. That Act provides for pension payments to be made out of the fund for those pensions. However, it does not provide for the transfer of pension rights already accrued to be paid out of the fund. These types of payments, known as bulk transfers, will be necessary to transfer  accrued rights into a new scheme if that is what the Government decide. The proposed amendment enables that by allowing payments to be made out of the general lighthouse fund which will include the bulk transfers.

Amendment 41 amends schedule 10 by replacing the reference to the Northern Lighthouse Board with the correct name of this body, which is the Commissioners of Northern Lighthouses. It does not change the policy objective or the persons affected in any way. It simply clarifies the name of the public body in question.

Photo of Cathy Jamieson Cathy Jamieson Shadow Minister (Treasury)

I am sure there will be great interest in the correct terminology. I will resist the temptation to ask the Minister how many lighthouses or how many individuals could be affected by this change. We will give him some respite and not seek an answer to that question just now. It is right to ensure that the Bill uses the correct terminology and that where pension rights have to be transferred, it is done correctly. We would not want any unintended consequences of drafting that did not have the correct terminology. I am sure that everyone who might be affected will be pleased that the Minister has brought forward these amendments.

Amendment 40 agreed to.

Question proposed, That the schedule, as amended, be the Eighth schedule to the Bill.

Photo of Sajid Javid Sajid Javid The Economic Secretary to the Treasury

The schedule lists the consequential and minor amendments to other pieces of legislation that will be made by the Bill. These amendments include changes to the existing legislation which provides for public service pension schemes, and changes to wider pensions legislation. Many of these amendments will help to prevent existing legislation from being used to create new pension schemes, and in some cases injury or compensation schemes, for public service workers. This will ensure that in future any new schemes for these workers will be made under the provisions in the Bill.

The amendments also ensure that the new pension schemes made under the Bill will be included in the annual Treasury order that uprates all public service pensions in payment. Other amendments will allow parliamentary staff to join the civil service pension scheme; allow pensions for judges at the European Court of Human Rights to be made under the Bill; allow all members of pensions boards established as a committee of a local authority to vote in that committee; and ensure that judges’ pensions will always remain a matter for the Lord Chancellor.

Question put and agreed to.

Schedule 8, as amended, accordingly agreed to.