Clause 10
Counter-Terrorism Bill
4:00 pm
David Heath (Somerton and Frome, Liberal Democrat)
I am very worried by that intervention, not least because I believe the hon. Gentleman holds the office of constable. If that is the case, he has a profound misunderstanding of the principle of innocence until found guilty. Consorting with criminals is a rather archaic offence, but even if one is not found guilty of that before a court, it is not something that I would immediately use in support of an argument. Anyway, I shall set that aside as I do not think that it is typical of the views of the Conservative party on this; it is the view of the hon. Gentleman to which he is perfectly entitled.
The subsections that I suggest could be removed are those that deal with retention. The clause states:
“Where fingerprints or samples are taken from a person who is subject to a control order the fingerprints or samples may be retained after they have fulfilled the purposes for which they were taken”—
and it goes on to say—
“but shall not be used by any person except as described in subsection (1AB).”.
I accept that. However, the measure is still a matter of some concern, because control orders, whether or not they are a good way of dealing with a particular problem, are exceptional as a class of punishment. They are a punishment without findings of guilt; punishment on suspicion, effectively. They are a way of ensuring that people are not a danger as a pre-emptive measure rather than post-charge and post-finding of guilt.
Therefore, to retain fingerprints and samples from such a person, against whom no charges have been put and against whom no case has been proven, seems to be at the very least dubious, and to do so after these samples have fulfilled the purposes for which they were taken is dubious in the extreme. So, I suggest that we need to take great care to examine whether this measure is proportionate and appropriate, and also to examine the value that it will have. It may be that the Minister can persuade me that there are circumstances in which this measure will be of enormous value and that it is right for these subsections to be included in the Bill, but I am not yet convinced of that case.