Clause 3
Statistics and Registration Service Bill
5:15 pm
Mark Hoban (Shadow Minister, Treasury; Fareham, Conservative)
It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr. Olner.
In his closing remarks on the previous group of amendments, the hon. Member for Twickenham said that other models were available. He called the one that we are discussing the Mongolian model; that would establish a structure similar to that of the NAO asa means of governing the statistics board and theONS.
I would prefer not to call it the Mongolian model; we could use a word much closer to home—[Interruption.] We could call it the Blackburn model. In 1995, the right hon. Member for Blackburn (Mr. Straw), now the Leader of the House, said in a speech:
“The National Statistical Service should be placed at arm’s length to Ministers on a similar basis to that of the National Audit Office, and should report principally to a powerful Committee of the Commons”.
We should give the right hon. Gentleman the credit for identifying that model, and refer to it as the Blackburn model. Why did he suggest that that might be the right approach for the governance of the new board? He did so because the NAO is recognised for its independence from the Government; that independence is created not just through its robust reports to Parliament on how taxpayers’ money is spent, but because it is seen to be demonstrably at arm’s length from the Treasury and all other Government Departments.
The National Audit Act 1983 established the Public Accounts Commission, which is responsible for the appointment of the Comptroller and Auditor General and determining the funding of the National Audit Office. Following that model will best ensure that the new board establishes a reputation like that of the NAO. This is the best opportunity to enshrine the independence of national statistics and put them at arm’s length, not only from the Treasury—this is not about Treasury bashing at all—but from all Government Departments.
The new clause and schedule replicate the wording of the 1983 Act. They would set up the commission and establish how its members were appointed. However, I should like to draw attention to the crucial difference, in respect of commission membership, between the model proposed by the new clause and schedule and that introduced by the 1983 Act. The Public Accounts Commission is drawn from Members of this House. However, interest in statistics’ importance, use and accuracy, and how they are used to hold the Government to account, is felt not only in this House, but in the other place. We feel that the other place should be represented in the commission. Many Lords have an interest in the issues; Lord Moser’s views have already been referred to in the context of that wider interest.
We believe that the model is right; it has proved to work with the NAO. The NAO seems independent of the Government and we should consider how to apply its model to the board and its executive and scrutiny functions. Why might that not be right? In his evidence to the Treasury Committee, the Minister touched on one potential reason when he said that the NAO
“has a very particular role in supporting Parliament's proper scrutiny and accountability function in relation to the executive.”
He went on to say that
“the purpose, the value, the users of national statistics, go very much wider than Parliament.”
He was right; no one would disagree. However, we should also ensure that we do not minimise the vital role of statistics in enabling Parliament to hold the Executive to account.
For example, measuring the number of children achieving five or more good GCSEs does not just provide data to parents, schools, employers or local councils; it helps hon. Members to hold the Government to account on their own policy goals. Data on productivity will help us to decide how the Chancellor is doing by what he refers to as the fundamental yardstick of economic performance. Without accurate, robust data, it is difficult for us to hold the Government to account. The distinction between the role of the National Statistics Board and that of the National Audit Office is perhaps not as great as the Minister indicated.