New Clause 4
Safeguarding Vulnerable Groups Bill [Lords]
3:30 pm
Maria Miller (Shadow Minister (Education), Education; Basingstoke, Conservative)
I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
I am pleased that we have reached new clause 4; we have had many discussions during the past few days, and it has looked doubtful whether we would get this far.
We grappled with the important issue that the new clause addresses on the first day of our proceedings; I hope that it gives us an opportunity to flesh out further the arguments and discussions about it. The definitions of “frequently” and “occasionally” have been a vexed question throughout discussions of this Bill in both Houses. Originally, the new clause was to have been reviewed and discussed alongside our original amendment to remove the idea of “frequently” from the Bill and allow professional people within the settings covered to establish a definition of “occasional” relevant to their setting.
One of Lord Adonis’s notes attempted to clarify the meaning of “frequently”, and in doing so define what was meant by “occasionally”. At that point, it was said that if an activity was undertaken for longer than five days continuously, or more than six times a year, it would be deemed to take place frequently and be subject to monitoring.
That strikes us as a rather arbitrary figure in respect of what constitutes “frequently” as opposed to “occasionally”. Can the Minister say anything that would suggest that there is more robustness behind the thinking? If so, he should share it with us, as we have been unable to find that in correspondence on this subject.
At another juncture, Lord Adonis stated that it would perhaps be up to the barred individual to determine whether contact was occasional or frequent. We Conservatives feel that that argument is unacceptable. I should be interested in hearing the Minister’s view. Can the Government be reasonably expecting those who are subject to the rules in the Bill to determine whether they are undertaking activities on an occasional or frequent basis?