Schedule 1
Commissioner for Older People (Wales) Bill [Lords]
10:30 am
Cheryl Gillan (Shadow Secretary of State for Wales, Wales; Chesham and Amersham, Conservative)
I want to reassure the Minister that I do not intend to make any lengthy speeches during examination of the Bill. Rather, I shall use certain of my amendments to probe for details. Those remarks apply directly to this group of amendments—I shall use them as a vehicle, rather than pressing them to a vote.
Paragraph 2 allows the Assembly to make regulations setting out arrangements
“as to the appointment of the Commissioner”
and on the terms and conditions of his office, and the amendments flow from that paragraph and from subsequent points that are made in the schedule.
The First Minister will be responsible for appointing the commissioner, and my first question is why the Minister arrived at that decision. Is there a role for the Assembly to play a part in the commissioner’s recruitment and appointment? Indeed, what process will be used to allow the Assembly itself to participate in the selection process, and who will be on the appointment panel? Is it envisaged that only members of the Welsh Assembly Government will be involved in appointment, or will members of the Opposition parties be able to play a part? How will the Minister ensure that the selection process is conducted by a balanced set of individuals? For example, will there be representatives of older people on the selection panel and will there be representatives on the panel of those who work with older people?
There was discussion at several stages during the progress of the Bill on the commissioner’s term of office of four years, renewable for a further four years. Why has that term been left to regulations and why has it not instead been included in the Bill? Hon. Members will correct me if I am wrong, but I believe that there was a meeting of minds on the term of office during the consultation process, so it seems to me that it is an admirable candidate for inclusion in the Bill. Perhaps the Minister can enlighten us on the thinkingabout that.
I should like to know who can remove the commissioner from office. Can only the First Minister do that, and what is the process for removing a commissioner who has not fulfilled the expected standards? I understand that there are proposals for removing the commissioner if the commissioner is deemed to have misbehaved, and I am hoping that the Minister will take the opportunity to define “misbehaviour”.
I would next like to probe a little further on the way in which the commissioner will operate, and to ask how the commissioner will be able to operate independently. If, as it would appear, the First Minister appoints and also removes the commissioner, there should be due process, including an appeal process for the commissioner, whereby the commissioner can disagree with his dismissal. Will the Minister expand on that?
Amendment No. 4 probes the ex gratia payments that are allowed under schedule 1. Paragraph 3(3) of that schedule says:
“If a person ceases to be the commissioner and it appears to the Assembly that there are special circumstances that make it right that the person should receive compensation, the Assembly may pay to that person a sum of such amount as it thinks appropriate.”
Will the Minister enlighten us as to how that sum would be arrived at and who would decide upon it? Does the provision really mean that the Assembly would decide, or would it in effect be the First Minister who would agree the sum? If there is wherewithal within the legislation for an ex gratia payment of an unspecified amount to be made effectively on a whim, or in “special circumstances”—I would like the Minister to define that term—how can the commissioner operate independently of the Government of the day in the Assembly? Should there perhaps be a ceiling to the amount, and, if not, will the Minister explain what would happen in the event of an employment dispute between the commissioner and the Welsh Assembly Government?
Paragraph 7 of schedule 1 refers to “Payments by the Assembly.” Will the Minister set out exactly what the paragraph means? The words “as it thinks appropriate” are, again, very general. Surely there is a need for safeguards in relation to an open-ended financial opportunity whereby the commissioner and his office receive unlimited sums for unspecified purposes.
The group of amendments is large, but the questions are fairly straightforward and I hope that the Minister will be able to respond.