Clause 12 - Application by prosecution for certain counts to be tried without a jury
Domestic Violence, Crime and Victims Bill [Lords]
2:30 pm
Ms Harriet Harman (Solicitor General, Law Officers' Department; Camberwell and Peckham, Labour)
We shall press forward with our amendment. In response to the hon. Members for Somerton and Frome (Mr. Heath) and for Beaconsfield I ask the Committee to consider the following points. Is the judicial discretion too wide, without the Government amendment, in making decisions about what is a sample case? We know that there has to be some judicial discretion, because we cannot foresee every consequence. We all agree that we cannot prescribe for the judges, who will have to consider matters case by case. The question is where the line is drawn. There is enough to make it clear to the judges what Parliament intend a sample count to be. We cannot anticipate all the different
circumstances, but that does not mean that we have left the judges to their own devices, saying, ''Use your judicial discretion''—far from it.
I should like to draw the Committee's attention to the three conditions set out in subsections (3), (4) and (5).
''The first condition is that the number of counts included in the indictment is likely to mean that a trial by jury involving all of those counts would be impracticable.''
They must get over that test first; it must be impracticable to have all the counts on the same indictment.
''The second condition is that, if an order under subsection (2) were made, each count or group of counts which would accordingly be tried with a jury can be regarded as a sample of counts which could accordingly be tried without a jury.''
It must be impracticable, a sample and
''in the interests of justice''.