Clause 98 - Temporary event notice
Licensing Bill [Lords]
10:00 am
Dr Kim Howells (Parliamentary Under-Secretary, Department for Culture, Media & Sport; Pontypridd, Labour)
We have had an excellent debate, with some strong arguments. Hon. Members are right to point out that it is never easy to set such limits; indeed, it is very difficult. I shall try to answer all the questions, but I wish to preface my remarks by saying that arguments completely counter to those that we have heard this morning could be advanced if we were representing the interests of the constituents who live near such events. Hon. Members have, very properly, spoken about balance. Let us remember that when we talk about balance and trying to get the limits right, we must consider those who live close to the venues.
I have had it put to me, as I am sure other hon. Members have, that at least the misery has a time limit—that is a phrase to remember. Without proper and rigorous examination of venues and events, we must ensure that the limits on time and on the number of people who are likely to participate do not allow people to take advantage of the situation, to the detriment of those who live nearby.
On previous amendments, I have stated that the system set out in the Bill is designed to deliver a light touch. However, there must be safeguards and controls to protect the rights of local residents and to prevent unscrupulous individuals from exploiting the arrangements to circumvent the licensing regime. The hon. Member for Isle of Wight has tabled amendments Nos. 417 and 418, which would allow licensable activities to continue under a temporary event notice for up to 14 days, rather than the 72 hours for which the Bill provides, if such licensable activities are incidental, as he put it, to non-licensable activities.
I do not believe that the amendments are necessary. In response to concerns raised in another place, the Government have exempted all incidental music from the requirement for authorisation altogether. If someone wishes to organise, say, a week-long flower festival, and wants recorded classical music playing in the background or a pianist playing background music in the corner, they will not need to give a temporary event notice.
Although it is easy to think of circumstances in which music may be incidental to another, non-licensable, activity, it is more difficult to imagine how the sale of alcohol could ever be purely an incidental activity. The hon. Member for Isle of Wight was quite right to point out that, although many of us might enjoy going for other reasons, the main purpose
of an agricultural show, or flower show, is to watch the animals or look at the flowers, or otherwise take part. Nevertheless, drinking can form a very important part of such occasions. He well knows that, very occasionally, things can get out of hand. That is why we have licensing laws in the first place.
We would not want the supply of alcohol to be treated as incidental to other non-licensable activities, but that is what might happen as a result of his amendment. I am sure that the hon. Gentleman does not want that to happen either, because of the implications. More importantly, the amendments are not desirable. I think that we all accept that the sale or supply of alcohol raises some very special issues, and it is only right, for proper public protection, that those issues should be scrutinised. I doubt whether the public would thank us if we put the sale or consumption of alcohol outside the licensing regime altogether because of some notion that it is incidental to the main purpose of an agricultural show or a flower show. I am sure that the hon. Gentleman would not mean that to happen, but that is the sense that I get from the amendments.