Clause 8 - Tests for registration: utility and least suffering
Hunting Bill
9:15 am
Mr Alun Michael (Minister of State (Rural Affairs), Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs; Cardiff South and Penarth, Labour/Co-operative)
It would be helpful if the hon. Gentleman returned to the section of Burns to which I have referred. He will see that his conclusion is totally contradicted by Lord Burns. He asks whether I want to save the lives of numbers of hares or to prevent people's enjoyment. Neither of those are material considerations. The consideration is whether the activity has utility, which, by definition, it does not, and whether it is the cruel. Does the method of achieving utility, which the activity does not have, involve the least suffering? It is absolutely clear what we have to do about coursing.
The hon. Member for North Wiltshire referred to listening to people. He suggested that I should listen to a variety of organisations with which he has sympathy. I have tried to listen to everyone. I have listened to organisations whose conclusions I thought might not satisfy the test, against the possibility that they might. I have had an open-door and open-ear policy from the beginning of the consultation and have sought to give everyone an opportunity to make their case.
The hon. Gentleman continually refers to Government Members who listen to animal welfare organisations. Many of my hon. Friends have done what I have done: yes, we have listened to animal welfare organisations, but we have also listened to the Countryside Alliance, land managers and farmers. I suggest that the hon. Gentleman might come to a more balanced view if he included animal welfare organisations on his list so that he, too, could listen to all the arguments that can be reasonably made on the issue.