Clause 31 - Hearing witnesses in the uk by telephone
Crime (International Co-operation) Bill [Lords]
4:15 pm
Mr Bob Ainsworth (Parliamentary Under-Secretary, Home Office; Coventry North East, Labour)
Although we understand the desire to protect the rights of witnesses, we do not consider that the amendments are necessary. Witnesses agreeing to give evidence in such a way have sufficient protection. Article 11(2) of the MLAC provides that witnesses may be heard by telephone only if they agree to the hearing. There is no question of issuing summonses to unwilling witnesses, because there is no power to summons witnesses for telephone hearings. The Bill provides for a court to make arrangements to hear evidence, but not for it to compel witnesses.
Under domestic law, there is no obligation for anyone appearing as a witness to seek legal advice, nor is there any automatic right to it. It would not be right or consistent to require that a person has received legal advice in such circumstances, when the UK does not require that in respect of domestic criminal proceedings, either for witnesses, whether willing or unwilling, or even defendants, who are not covered by the provision.
The clause as drafted requires the requesting country to confirm that the witness is willing to give evidence by telephone in proceedings before the overseas court. As an additional safeguard, the court is also required to be satisfied that the witness is willing, thereby protecting him if, having agreed to give evidence, he changes his mind by the time of the hearing.
The provision does not have general application and we do not expect it to be used frequently—not all member states are able to request that kind of assistance. We understand that it is mainly used by Scandinavian countries. Schedule 2 provides that such hearings, like those via television link, will be conducted under the supervision of the requesting state and in accordance with its law.
That is our fairly firm position. The only doubt that creeps into my mind is our preceding conversation and the issue of circumstances. I am not sure whether that would impact on anything, because there is no requirement to ensure that legal advice is given to witnesses in domestic proceedings. The witnesses must be certified as being willing, and the court must check that they are willing. To insist that they receive legal advice is an unnecessary step.