Clause 2 - Statutory paternity pay
Employment Bill
12:00 pm
Mr Alan Johnson (Minister of State (Employment and the Regions), Department of Trade and Industry; Kingston upon Hull West and Hessle, Labour)
In relation to amendments Nos. 135 and 136, new section 171ZI enables the Secretary of State to make regulations dealing with the application of statutory paternity pay to those employed or living outside Great Britain, mariners and continental-shelf workers. The provisions mirror those for statutory maternity pay, and we would expect to make regulations in the same way. Amendments Nos. 135 and 136 would remove paragraphs that will allow us to make regulations specifying who may or may not be eligible to receive paternity pay. Regulations under these paragraphs will be necessary if we are to follow the SMP model.
For example, the SMP legislation excludes a woman from receiving maternity pay if she is a mariner employed by a UK employer on a foreign-going vessel while under a contract for which an employer pays a special low rate of national insurance contributions, and we must mirror that in the paternity pay regulations. A woman who is a continental-shelf worker or a mariner employed by a UK employer would be covered by the SMP scheme. Employers and employees in these special circumstances know how the SMP rules work, and it is right that we should mirror those rules for statutory paternity pay.
Amendments Nos. 159, 160, 161 and 163 relate to making it clear on the face of the Bill that people who are not normally resident in Great Britain and who do not maintain a residence here will not be eligible for adoption pay—the clause relates to adoption pay, not paternity pay. I accept that it is unlikely that situations will arise in which a person in those circumstances will qualify for adoption pay, but it is possible and should not be ruled out. It is possible, for example, to think of an employee working abroad for a UK employer who is still a British-employed worker for social security and tax purposes but who no longer maintains a British residence. That employee may want to take a year off work in order to adopt and care for a child. In such cases, as with a birth mother who is in a similar position, we might want to ensure that the entitlement to pay is safeguarded because the employee has earned that right.
I would not swear by the validity of that example, and I could not put my hand on my heart and say that I know exactly how we would use the regulations because we still have thinking to do in relation to the clause, including consultation with adoption experts. However, I hope that I have done enough to allow hon. Members to understand that there are issues about which it may be worth thinking, and it would be wrong to be inflexible and state once and for all on the face of the Bill that there can be no entitlement. That issue, and our desire to mirror the SMP regulations, are the reasons why we hope that the hon. Gentleman will withdraw the amendments.